Unknown Speaker 00:04 Department of Environment. While briefly be described, in some ways, the computers and related communications technology are increasingly altering the ways that we do work, to business shop. information within household environments are concerned like not with the technological innovations per se. But with the social imagination, which computer applications are being mapped out today. I think that we get a whole lot about social imagination. This morning, in particular, daddy harrowing, but in particular, I'll be talking about the way the home and family life are being imaged in the current social discourse about the electronic cottage. I'll be discussing some assumptions about what home and the ways that I do it. How interactive information services have been developed, marketed, regulated, and counseled into their integration into American households. Workshop is an attempt to keep together the diverse needs to which the information revolution, it's been dreamed about, and socialized. The only be time to briefly touch on all these different areas. So I provided the bibliography for which you can go into more detail if you want to. My hope is that we'll be able to spend the last half hour session discussing some of your thoughts about this, as well. It's hard to lie flat. But the slide projector hasn't arrived yet. So we'll be doing that at the end of the session. So I'd run advertising and illustrations. Newspaper articles reflect the images of power and empowerment that are being used to present microcomputers and the place in our lives. In many ways, what I presented today is one half of the picture of the dialectic. The other half is how individuals and social groups to be adapting, rejecting or reinventing new and unplanned users for computers and telecommunications technologies. While my analysis isn't a deterministic one, I think the dialectical interrelationship between different groups is something which takes a good deal of time to evolve, and the time for us to become visible. It's important in 1983, to examine the social messages, which are accompanying the introduction of new technology into American households, along with self reported home based workers. While I'll be focusing mostly on computer applications, and social messages that are arising primarily out of business, government and government today, I hope we'll be thinking about the changing presence of technology in online and how to people that you know, it can be difficult to reflect on the conditions and physical world that we're totally familiar with. But it doesn't mean that we are simply that we simply absorb these, these objects uncritically. I'm increasingly aware of the ways that television has eliminated as many perspectives as it has to amplify. And I always remember the grandfather, to express your sense of distance from the car by calling the machine guy either get the machine so thinking about what technology assessors called diffusion in mindset, you know, it's one way check out the stories of glistening smooth adoption, or rejection forget forecasters predict. Feminist historian sociologists and economists, such as Dr. Colin birch Evanna have written extensively on complex causes and consequences of the history of the absorption of domestic technologies into middle class households. They show that appliances and utilities made housework less arduous. This is mentioned this morning, as well as the fact that it's tended to increase the isolation of women has left relatively unaltered, the sex the status of housework, and time spent doing. Designers, architectural historians and city planners such as Hayden Glenn, right. She went to Brett Wiseman also demonstrated the anti feminist planning of housing, neighborhoods, as well as the racially and sexually discriminatory policies and federal housing programs, zoning ordinances, mortgage lending plans, etc. When I put together everything that I know about the socially stratified structure of housing, the largely irrational organization of neighborhood the lack of architectural forethought about the use of residential environments is complex and affectionate workplaces. I still find myself to be I didn't, but I don't entirely make my own home. Unknown Speaker 05:05 I'd read Marxist oriented social science literature like Senate rescue and a cost savings at home and personal life is a convention which compensates for meaningless work. When I'm reading these, though, I tend to think that they're not talking about their own homes. I believe that one of the reasons it's hard to reflect on both the social nature of private schools, as well as one's personal involvement in the political questions everyday life, is it within the ideology of individualism vital to industrial capitalism, interrelationship between classes between races, between sexes, and between spheres of public life and private life, become mentally erased, and replaced by conception with each category as separate, separate, self propelled and individually controlled. The way that these interrelationships are concealed and the concept of home as a private and separate sphere involves the bundles of contradictions. The composed seemingly obvious ideas about what a home is, for instance, home is a place which represents continuity to family life. Home is a female space. Home is a refuge from work and public life. The notion that home represents continuity to family life conceals the way that home is an historically changing category. It conceals the way that people live under conditions, which encourage them to make and break relationships. And the continuity involves the ability to maintain overtime relationships between people, and between people in places which may be destroyed by forces over which we have no control. And addition, not everyone can, can or wants to live with a family. Continuity to family history is just one form of community memory. To notion that home with a female space can be documented in the sense that women do spend more time there, and the primary responsibility for the creation and maintenance to the setting and report more often than men do, that they feel attached to and identified with their homes. The notion that home is female, conceals, however, the role of men in the Division of physical environments into male and female domains. Cultural geographers have pointed out to the cultural definition of places, including the home generally represent the power elite of a society and leave unnamed and undefined, what constitutes private and public space for those with less power in society. The notion that home is a refuge for work in public life first assumes that one works outside the house. And this work is alienating labor and is not energizing or rewarding. It assumes that one returns to a place which is not itself another workplace. Read to each work many directly from the order of business and industrial work. And everyone requires some form of shelter. But of home is defined as non workplace, whereas home for working mothers. In addition, this concept of home as refuge overlooks away the conflict generated at work and in the world at large. emerge within households. And the ways that one, that one member of a household may find it to be a place of violence, while another may find it to be a sanctuary. And this is changing perceptions, like the patterns of work and the economy of households all change over time. wide variety of writers have demonstrated Marx's idea that well people make their own choices and in a sense their own history did not make the conditions under which these choices are made. We know that were thought to be our most personal choices, both involving emotional and sexual expression. And choices about giving birth and having children are never untouched by are of little consequence to the political economy of the state. Or the religious, legal and medical institutions, which give legitimacy or illegitimacy to the choices that we make. I'm suggesting that social definition of what makes a good woman as well as what makes a good home. Our bundle which bundle our diverse experiences into overly confident categories, as always the damage the serious threat that they pose to every woman. One of the reasons it's important to begin this discussion with a renewed interest in a contradictory and inaccurate image of home as a separate sphere in industrial capitalist culture, is that forecasters experts and planners of the computerized society are using this very biased and incomplete notion upon as a way of explaining the social impact of computers and related to communications technologies today. Unknown Speaker 09:55 The question we must ask is whether the introduction of home computers and communications techniques Do you promise to expand the reach of households, in fact alter whether they in fact alter or reinforce, to social organization upon as a privatized and separate sphere. So what is an electronic cottage? First of all, I think it's a new version of a model home it's the current, it's the current image of a middle class luxury dream home. While there probably always been different forms of domestic code, and different ways that these codes are circulated, the model home has been used as a vehicle for introducing new technologies and applications of industrial work methods is to household for at least 100 years. Whether or not modern model environments operate the way they promised. Model homes would be toured by 1000s of visitors to exhibitions and world affairs, photographed and reproduced by millions magazines, and uses the focus of home economics training. In so doing, they develop the genre, which elevates the status and freezes one kind of physical environment is the image of how good people live. They engage the viewer in an anticipatory process, dream about the life that they could be leading. Alvin Toffler is writing about the electronic cottage in his book The third wave, just the Shona, it is less concrete, in a sense more suggestive than those which were physically built. Leaving illustrators designers and art editor's all over the world scrounging to come up with a picture of the electronic cottage is similar to her report, in some ways, to the pre industrialized household, and that it raises once more on a macro it raises once more on a mass scale, the possibility of husbands and wives and perhaps even children working together as a unit. While talk was thinks that the nuclear family is actually withering away, along with the social forms generated by an industrial capitalist nation on its way to becoming a high technology, technological, capitalist nation. He states that quote, When campaigners of family life, discover the possibilities inherent in the transfer of work to the home, we may see a rising demand for political measures to speed up the process, tax incentives, for example, and new conceptions of workers rights. Just one year after he wrote this book, Newt Gingrich, a conservative Republican from Georgia, introduced into Congress the family Opportunity Act, which would have passed around to people to say in the Ways and Means Committee, and suggest we write our congress people about it. The family Opportunity Act provides $100 tax credit per family member for a period of five years as an as an incentive for purchasing a home computer. For example, if a family of five, a $4,000 home computer, and 1000 hours worth of software in 1983, they could take a $500 a year tax credit. So the financial aid to computer and software was it only cost $2,500. Rather than chocolate correctly predicting as he's often been described, this governmental support family computers, Congressman Gingrich states in his press release that it was taught was ideas about the electronic cottage, providing opportunities for home based workers and more education at home, which influenced his writing of the bill. I want to read to you what H R 6397 introduced in May 2019 82 states as its purposes. The purposes of this Act are to increase individual economic opportunity. Expand the potential for individuals to own their own businesses. Restore the family setting by allowing families to learn and earn together at home. develop opportunities for Americans handicapped and disabled citizens provide a growing pool of computer literate young people who can enter the job to the future and man the sophisticated military of tomorrow and to decrease home to Office computing and national dependence on imported oil. Unknown Speaker 14:26 It's the whole agenda. Of course, the household has to have the $4,000 to purchase the computer and the income level to which they can take the tax deductions. But this bill makes clear that the pro family like sees home computers is a good organizing tool which to hang their entire political agenda. They view the creation of the electronic cottage as a way of shoring up the privatized family by decreasing the influence of work settings in schools, the influence of peers really on adults in our children and increase can influence the family members on one another. As well as whatever's coming through the the computer and video screen. They see it as a way of dissolving governmental responsibility to create barrier free environments for people with mobility problems, and as a way of increasing the potential of technological warfare, as well as a way of providing greater access information to only those households which are middle class families. Right now, I want to tell you a little bit about the computer innovations and the applications of them. There may be people here who know a good deal more about this than I do, and some people who know less about this, but we need a common base. And if you have any ideas about ways of expanding on me know more about these applications or about how they're taking place, please feel free to to mention them. What makes possible any type of small scale computer communications operation is the result of the development of the microchip. Microchip replaces the room size computer of the 1950s with a tiny chip that fits in the palm of the child's hand, and has the capacity to be combined with a wide array of other electronic devices, such that they too can become intelligent, and perform computations, recall information stored in them or make comparisons. Microchip is a single integrated circuit on an on a chip of silicon mounted on a heavy plastic circuit board. They constitute the computer's primary memory, where both instructions and data is stored. The microchip manufacturer is what you heard a lot about this morning. It's primarily being done by third world women in this country and all over the world, working for wages between $1 and $5 a day. The result of this microchip, however, is that computers can be used more widely and thus more cheaply. One set of applications can be seen in what's thought of as within household uses. They include using a tiny computer system to control other electronic devices such as lights, their stove, record player, coffee maker, anything like that. Other than household uses are becoming more widespread as well include video games, as well as microprocessors for calculating keeping records and files that you store yourself and articles and computer magazines today. Women have generally told that they should use these to keep recipes on and to do their household budget. Anyone I know it was used as a ridiculous way of handling it and so much more complicated things in your car. Unknown Speaker 17:41 Yeah often Unknown Speaker 17:51 come up with any think of something awesome. The distinction is made between these micro computers, which tend to have one type of function and what is called a personal computer or home computer, which offers a wide array of capabilities. Complete home computers cost about $5,000 and often include or can be linked to secondary memories in the form of cassette tape to disk, and a device called the modems permits communication between computers over a telephone line. The real power of home computers lies in these connections to external information services, and information banks with combinations of computers and two way cables such as your telephone or cable television, or the beam of satellites, or why we're away of Information Services for the home and currently being tested. They include home shopping services, banking news delivery library research travel arrangements, entertainment scheduled ticket ticket reservations electronic mail targeted advertising. In Columbus, Ohio. The most advanced interactive information system for the home is currently in use to test site for one or MX cable Communications Corporation. The Cube experiment is called uses a keypad response device with a cable television to receive and send information. The programs being offered include local college courses, which students can participate with the instructor in a lifetime electronic classroom and instructor can for instance add how many people have just understood the point they were trying to make, or how many people are listening at any one time. During a hosted talk show program called Columbus alive. Viewers are often polled as to their perceptions on a local issue. In the tube system has been used to conduct your responses to national presidential addresses just like an instant referendum possibility to use several types of home security systems are also offered to cube. They include smoke detectors burglar alarm, as well as the direct button to call police or to call ambulance. Video programs called infomercials. Also blend once and for all commercials and entertainment. For instance, read more bookstores has a program which is billed as a book review hour. But at the end of the book review hour, you can push your button and decide to purchase and have sent to your home any of the books which were just reviewed because you know they also sell books. The computer gathers the other necessary information such as your name and address. The most lucrative business applications are seen as those involved in the collection of this demographic information never before available to advertisers, pollsters and marketing firms. These two way computers can cross reference answers to opinion questions about a product or political candidate with income level consumer profile and voting record, and, or in any other information that the viewer has revealed through their interaction with the system. Well at first glance, video shopping computer access to libraries, electronic banking and mail, and video courses for college credit local universities all appear to save time, money and energy for women who are always short of all three. The substitution of electronic communication for face to face contact involves a variety of problems and dangers for all of us and for women in particular. Clearly any system that allows you to gather information electronically allows others to gather information about you. While no more requires the cable operators tell viewers that they're being monitored, and that they are that they are through their interactions. Unknown Speaker 21:53 With the cable system, creating information dossiers on your household economy and political viewpoints. Cube executives have reported at a meeting of the communication Council, the National Council of Churches in New York, the cube is more concerned about the individual's right to privacy than the subscribers are, quote, we expected it to be much more of an issue to the public than it was turned out to be I quote, two states have passed privacy protection laws affecting cable systems. Illinois prohibits the installation of equipment that can observe individuals in their homes and restricts the disclosure of subscribers viewing habits or identities. Wisconsin restricts disclosure of viewer data without consent. There is however, no foolproof regulation. Once the information is stored, anyone or any agency with access to the central computer system has access to the viewers dossier. Both the Carter and Reagan Administration have taken elected regular let the market regulate itself kind of position on this question. While consumer advocates such as Ralph Nader James rule and John McMullen, ascribe to the need for privacy protection legislation. In a 1971 Apparently unpublished article called privacy is not the issue by Susan Krieger. She turns the tables on both sides of this difficult question, by showing the protections of privacy have always been quote, protections of power and privilege. And that wellbeing in the well being and freedom depends on the quality of community life and the nature of political action, or quote, she suggested a privacy regulation is a means of dealing with the undesired effects of the ever expanding commute, computer and telecommunications penetration into our lives is tantamount to telling the family that by building a bomb shelter in his backyard, they will protect themselves from nuclear war. protecting privacy in what is clearly a fishbowl society may be less important, she says then ensuring that we deal decently with each other, and that the least powerful among us are done justice by what is known. What are some examples of uses of computers and communications technologies by grassroots community organization and women's and national women's organizations? They have of course not had the financial backing or the power brokerage or the communications industry itself. Many examples of these reside at the interactive telecommunications program library NYU, and I'm just going to tell you about one of them today. Recognizing that women have had limited success in changing the patterns of employment and commercial broadcasting, and then affecting sexual stereotyping. In TV programming, or in increasing the coverage of women's news, Jen Zimmerman sought to utilize the public access requirements of us satellites in her development of the National Women's agenda Satellite Services Project. Initially, she was given the go ahead from NASA to connect 100 women's organizations in six cities for Adi conferencing, telex, facsimile and data transmission, all the same services that Xerox and IBM provide to the multinational customers. But just prior to the first demonstration, which they would hook up San Francisco and Washington DC to the National Women's agenda conference, the project was forced off the satellite by NASA for refusing conditions that women would not discuss lesbianism and abortion via satellite. In what ways women would utilize telecommunications technologies to extend communication among ourselves is yet to be seen. Hey, pay along with video games word processing, budget planning, data storage, interactive information systems of all sorts to the home. Computers and telecommunications technologies are alternative ways that many women earn a living. Many jobs previously held by women such as telephone operators, librarians, airline reservation workers, bank tellers, store clerks and receptionists are currently being replaced by computers synthesized female voices or video display information while others may be shifted home. Given latest advances in word processing, Secretary, Secretary secretaries and all levels of information workers jobs no longer require or may no longer require that they be performed within traditional office spaces or traditional nine to five schedules. One of the biggest obstacles that's mentioned to this generally is that managers tend to want to be able to visually monitored people that are working for them. Unknown Speaker 26:37 In recent National Science Foundation funded report, technology industry forecasters working with social scientists assessing the potential for what is called remote work, or telecommuting concluded that quote, the electronic cottage is the perfect solution to the problem of how women can have traditional careers and their children at the same time. Unknown Speaker 27:02 It's tied in in its teletext, video text in the US. And it's in a chapter called social impact social effects of computerization or something like that. It's it's a McGraw Hill press publication of the NSF report. Remote remote work programs are currently being tested by Continental Illinois de South Carolina mountain bill and many others. While much of the research on these experiments is proprietary and being done by the companies themselves, there are people doing research on this particular Margaret Olson at NYU. She's been interviewing has a wider array of people using computers for home based work. Some of those have been interviewed or organizational workers, which is what is also called pretty remote work, as well as entrepreneurial and freelance writers and software developers using a not very well identified sample. She's reported that women enjoying the women or she says that women are reporting that they enjoy the flexibility upon more of being home more of being able to be their children. They don't have to get dressed up and go to work, you might be able to not face rush hour traffic, and they liked being able to go shopping and use recreational facilities during non peak hours. Also was also reported that those interviewed with children had difficulty with their families accepting that they were working when at home, and when they were not available to take care of family maintenance needs. In some cases, this led to termination of work of the work at home arrangement. Nearly half of those interviewed also reported increased stress because of conflicting non work and work responsibilities and problems with eating more smoking more and drinking more coffee while working at home. There's also evidence of a concern that the long term career path of remote employee is limited in terms of lack of mentor relationships, contact with superiors and networking effect that what is generally not mentioned, however, in studies, is it homebase workers are never in unions are not so far. They've consistently lost any benefits that they've had. When working from the home. They absorb all of what have been the overhead costs their employees for years, such as heating or air conditioning, anything like that during the day, and that there are no standards for health or safety conditions for home workers. In addition, all home based organizations organizational work has been reorganized into task work. That is it's paid by the piece and not but the time spent working. This could have the greatest impact on the so called flexibility of the home based worker. We try to understand the chant how these changing conditions may affect the largest majority of women workers, not just those who are ready control have a good deal of control over their work conditions. In our choosing to write their book at home or writing in an office in universities something like that. We can see that all the same physical stresses known to reflect office space, word processor workers, as well as the unknown long term effects of radiation from video display terminals would pertain to the home based worker. The loss of face to face contact with peers and co workers means a serious loss for women in terms of their friendships, not just with superior their contact not just with superiors or mentors, but also their friendships, peers, as well as political organizing at work, and their ability to compare notes and working conditions, opportunities, speed ups, etc. The need the idea that a parent working at home could also care for small children at the same time, with no additional support in the House. Sounds to me like mother abuse or child abuse or both. The perception of home work, creating more flexibility in a woman's day may only be possible for women who already have a great deal of flexibility in their work and support in their households. For women who are under pressure to eat unnecessarily income level, production of flexibility belies the competition of the labor market. And the problems of meeting work quotas during weeks when children are sick or the boiler breaks or the computer fails. I think that electronic cottages the electronic cottage, as its model may be crowded and allows you to place to live. I think small computers should be thought of as utilities, and not as fetishize personal objects that could be built into apartment buildings like phones, they could be treated like laundry rooms or laundromats. There could be computer service sectors in ways that we don't have an image for today also. Unknown Speaker 32:01 And, and they need to be restricted to those families or those households that can afford to spend $5,000. My mother sent me a cartoon last week that I want to tell you about two women walk into a grocery store. One says to the other. I sincerely hope they don't start computer Home Shopping until I get rid of these coupons. This cartoon represents the feelings of many women who will be willing to trade in on the commercial systems and currently available means of living their lives of doing work housework and their paid work. They'd be willing to trade in on the double day. But with the development of the electronic cottage, bringing the power home, I think not. For women, the power debates that we've had, has largely been at home and bringing more electricity and more information services into a privatized household will not substitute for bringing the needy presence of women more out into the world. I'm going to show you some of these slides now. That we have. Yeah, I'm fat fast. And I read it so that I wouldn't get distracted into a lot of other things. But you want we can talk about just some and then go into the slides. Oh, okay. Why don't we do that. Unknown Speaker 33:34 As a computer owner user has an office workspace animal workspace. I agree with 99% of what you're saying in terms of potential negative potential the Innocence Project. But I think that the microcomputer which is the home is not only great expense, but it is a very powerful Unknown Speaker 33:55 tool Unknown Speaker 33:56 that we can use on behalf of our own communication network. I think that you focus on interactive communications as controlled by outside agencies, but influence that if you use a modem to connect you with anybody, you want to know that there is the potential for the Networkers among this network using that device as well as any other and that there are very powerful programs, you mentioned the recipe that is a trivial use of a very powerful tool known as a database. Anything in there organized in any way you want. You don't have to take your recipe for a lot of examples, letter for next to nothing and send it to your buddies. I mean, I think that that the potential for creative use of this tool is very great. It's way more than you imagined Unknown Speaker 34:45 and voice and that could happen Unknown Speaker 34:47 in a really thought. seek it out anyway, Unknown Speaker 34:51 I think about it all the time. Concerned with educational applications of micro computers in the education community and with children. That's our main concern. execute. So we're looking at software from the point of view of child development, we haven't taken that step that you've taken, I think it's an important step to take on the woman in the home setting, and on family life in general. But I think there's a lot of potential, I think it is still an expensive item, I think it is not available to every budget. But I think that we have the potential once the decrease in cost is realized. And that may be fancy too. But I'm my sense of it is that it really Unknown Speaker 35:32 knows if it's going to be different than the fantasies that I had 10 years ago about cable television and about community access to it. I mean, I feel like I've heard this before, I got very excited there are there are groups Unknown Speaker 35:44 that do network using this. They are groups that are privileged, they are financing. On the other hand, I know that I can create documents were sent to my friends and my colleagues in 1/10 of time it was protected. We do it because it's a workout. So I think there are really a lot of positive aspects to this. Yeah, I'm Unknown Speaker 36:05 really looking forward to having like a way of thinking about this efficiency or productivity kind of increase, but you got to do to get people. I feel like we don't have a good a good definition of no increased productivity in terms of Unknown Speaker 36:21 assessing whatsoever. Unknown Speaker 36:22 Yeah, and also what the losses are. What are we picking up in that? What? I don't know, if you have a way of defining that I was wondering, rather than Unknown Speaker 36:31 just working twice, twice as hard to ask yourself Unknown Speaker 36:38 this question provide information about what I have released when he was coming on the ground floor of COVID-19 at Chase Manhattan, during my position, extremely well paid, and she's excited about it. She left her earning trust to go to pay for this program, and they were leery whether they were afraid to lose her or not. And they didn't have the risk of interest or the risk potential she had. You mentioned home Maggie wants to play, you know anything about it to make it Unknown Speaker 37:07 to get you know, in terms of I don't know what it's not about that. I know that people who have enough money in Citibank got something in the mail saying that they can have a home computer that they can use electronic funds transfer now that it's just requires having both, you know, more than $5,000 in your account and the dollar home computer. Unknown Speaker 37:29 But it's in existence. And I Unknown Speaker 37:31 I think we'll probably know more about it today, I'm Unknown Speaker 37:36 taking him to them. Unknown Speaker 37:39 To them, okay, not only that Citibank is actually changing all the computers Unknown Speaker 37:43 completely, because, Unknown Speaker 37:44 as I understand, I'm going to do something that a few days ago that what they're trying to do is people with a minimal amount of funds are only going to be able to use the computers in the center. You know, they're the ones. Yeah, as opposed to going to a teller anyway, Unknown Speaker 38:02 because it's much, much cheaper. So actually, you know, Unknown Speaker 38:07 the computer is way banking since we go in. Yeah, that's Unknown Speaker 38:11 a different aspect of it. I mean, it's just an extension of those of those computer centers that already exist. Correct. description of how to stand on line, the very rich versus the poor people can't get a human answer. Yeah, and then we, Unknown Speaker 38:42 we just go on that. I see that also happening with Unknown Speaker 38:45 with the work that I think that I think he would be becoming much more of a separate player piano. I mean, describes a society that I couldn't become and where they are, and everybody will look in the same model how totally sexist society and a whole bunch of girls who didn't join and I see I see why your class positions without it and there'll be some of us who have privilege will network and that's nice. But I I'm very worried that I will do my Unknown Speaker 39:21 networking to your computer that you might not make it to as many conference. So I don't know. Have you seen anything in your own life like that where you tend to have less telephone contact or less face to face contact because you're using that Unknown Speaker 39:42 simulated to keep on making the info. If you do it that way you do it a million other ways. You can hear in the jobs Unknown Speaker 39:50 that keeps or just walked in, in general, Unknown Speaker 39:53 wanting more saying it doesn't Unknown Speaker 39:57 share your reservations. Unknown Speaker 40:02 Okay, what new technologies have often been represented to old ones. Telegraph is often portrayed as an angel. At first time, I thought that it was because it's very difficult to electricity is invisible in some ways, because he's mentioned this morning technology to have an invisible aspect to the someone's push to imagine something like a messenger from God. But Edward Carr Edmund Carpenter has also written a little bit about this and from a different perspective. He says that electricity is made angels of us all math angels in the Sunday School sense of being good or having wings, but spirit freed from flesh, capable of instant transportation anywhere. People have been envisioning progress. And as an individual propulsion forward or up in many ways for a prolonged period of time, enhanced mobility seems to have captured the imagination of many artists technological fantasies. In particular, the steam engine appears to have been most elaborated on upon in aid Lady 218 8070. Unknown Speaker 41:17 Yeah, Unknown Speaker 41:32 yeah, that's probably right. I think there were other other technological advances at that period. But I think the train was the most visceral, the most visible with the smoke and steam and it was going through so many places that the fantasy of of a steam man that would carry you to the to the countryside has shown up in a lot of illustrations and novels. And it appears in many forms the origin of Unknown Speaker 42:07 life This one includes all Unknown Speaker 42:12 of society. notion that the future involves the increase in speed and circulation, and individual proportion preoccupies many illustrations of the future. The Suburban dream house remains curiously unchanged. However, this is. Unknown Speaker 42:46 Yeah, yeah. Unknown Speaker 42:47 But I mean, this one, the spaceship fits into the driveway. And I've been trying to, to look through files on images of future and I find that that transportation is the main, the main phenomena, which is, which is viewed as the changing phenomenon. Unknown Speaker 43:13 The idea that new products create new contexts is the theme running through much of advertising the whole history of advertising, the context, the context is portrayed in terms in this case, in terms of a changed woman, which is much more quickly readable message then a changed physical environment, when they are advertising in this in this picture, though, is a boiler and not a vacuum cleaner. And a boiler is hard to image like life electricity. And so they utilized a much more quickly kind of projectable into and progress is also represented to remove between classes, which in this case is what proline so I'm sorry, that's backwards. Yeah, there are many, many examples of the transformed woman through the use of a new product, whether it's a an appliance or so. But but it's I think it makes clear that that maybe they understood that women didn't want to wash differently, they wanted a different world in which to watch. This inability in our own life to change the context in which you can change an activity but not stop that context. Advertising seems to have solved Unknown Speaker 44:44 miniaturization and miniaturization is similar in some ways to the word along the steam of the changed context and it really portrays it that the sense of the task becoming smaller oneself becoming larger or that that different world in which the task takes place. And miniaturization is throughout our enlargement of self and miniaturization of tasks, curves throughout the the student and potential. The same way that some objects are miniaturized, our bodies have been enlarged and created a kind of noir atmosphere which hassled work takes place, and in which a woman's body will help you do your work, you'll become a more attractive person, you'll be more carefree, and so you'll be much more sexually appealing your whole life. Unknown Speaker 45:56 This is a graphic from touching something. Okay for advertising household work was often portrayed as a direct relationship between women and those who may live with or cared for, rather than an indirect relationship to objects. Within welcomed by by RCA, the introduction of home computers in mainstream popular literature is often played upon the image of traditional figures who are unchanged in any way other than this new addition to their lives. They continue to play upon traditional women's crafts, to this combination of the video display screen and sampler. Unknown Speaker 46:52 And the well, and the mess in the questions that are really in the back of people's minds, this this one is a good example of a difference between what's in an image and what kind of text which people tend to read less in fact, but what they're when they're saying privacy begins at home, but they return to is IBM as a home. And the fact that they are they said they're reporting that they're erasing files you can have on workers, when they're saying that they have too much information that they understand it's dangerous for their employees, and they're voluntarily erasing. But I think that what what comes through to the person who's quickly going through the magazine is that message and IBM who in fact, is doing just the enforcement. Yeah, much of the advertising about computers today are, are addressed to men, the way that advertising about domestic technical or Farms is in the past have been addressed to them. And they're using equally sophisticated means for thinking about what's on men's minds and how to how to help them kind of imagine themselves using computers, they tend to also show transformed contexts, but in a different way. They showed men changing the context that they're in, like in this case, sort of moving out into this new world moving through a wall or door with forward as well as you know, out windows giving a sense that the communication which has been traditionally difficult for them is going to be much easier so computers you won't have to talk to your secretary or two people that you work with isolating interacting, but doorway, but they're but they are their portraits of free, you know, attempts to create a portrait of freedom in a non contextualized world. I mean, there are there I'm not saying that there are problems from anything Unknown Speaker 49:16 they also Unknown Speaker 49:21 just sort of, in a lot of ways, they really respond to a kind of fanciful sense of wanting to get things done, you know, move things around, move people around. And they ensure men still be in command Unknown Speaker 49:39 given the practice of computer, another person, or pet Unknown Speaker 49:50 No, I think there was actually Unknown Speaker 49:53 and I think what experience a lot of people have tried to work with computers, in many ways, is Then a few, she doesn't quite know what I had in mind and type something in something that none of you didn't understand. And that seems to be somewhat of a fracturing. Unknown Speaker 50:17 I think if you're also talking about the sense that you get instant feedback, you get instant strokes as I've read them, and described as I mean, there's a sense that there's a bigger response you get, you're getting back what you put in, and you're getting answers to questions, Unknown Speaker 50:33 once you are limited, but you see a lot of problems people have, and failure people have Unknown Speaker 50:40 is, I think, an experience when it comes back. And it's true, it's not, it's not you're not speaking about the initial experience having to learn how to use none of Unknown Speaker 50:56 them, saying it's the medical pet Unknown Speaker 51:05 specification of software application software is that people will be having to spend less and less time learning anything about the hardware or the programs and well, that less and less about the language these Unknown Speaker 51:30 images tend to be ambiguous and in particular art because the ambiguous and I don't know what time magazine was thinking of when they use historic Seagull sculpture there's a there's another half of that image with a woman just sort of sitting days from another chair with a computer terminal next to her but it's it's a highly ambiguous image about about a futures another dark and bleak one, I think. But the the article that was written along with it was like computers are next best thing to white bread, you know, it was really, really very, very on a very upbeat, very progressive for them. Unknown Speaker 52:17 Most of the things that's been happening in, in this in mind attempt to collect many illustrations that are meant to capture the reader's attention. Put one of the big being able to portray something that you can do the computer, the computer phenomena is new in some ways, but they're also often tried to show something which is even more new, which is dad working at Unknown Speaker 52:47 home. And Unknown Speaker 52:49 I think that this is some of the promise of computers today. Often articles which accompany illustrations that have men working at home are about women's jobs being transferred home, but the picture is of a man and I think the message is Dad's coming home to know that he he loves industrialization Yeah, well was playing with Unknown Speaker 53:26 her dad is paralyzed. Unknown Speaker 53:33 It was a woman working at home would have been kind of confusing for that because nobody would think much about it. Even if there was a small video display terminal sitting there. You couldn't show a woman in her house and have it the business right now. Unknown Speaker 53:57 No one would. Yeah. And nobody would imagine that she would. She would be able to I mean, the kids would that the kids would respect that or that she would actually be able to I mean, there's something about amount of families that those kids are generally they're generally short. And they just ran into the picture these are just some examples. You've probably seen these in the New York Times and all over the place was last year. how long he's going to be able to concentrate on his research is one of the questions or maybe the most opinions pictures along with dad coming home is that is that he's a part of this new model home in a very good way. Unknown Speaker 55:00 especially the articles that show you how to design your house for the computer and for working in your one room million dollar sacrifice list one of the things that's happening is that there are more and more letters to the editor and articles that are unsolicited that are appearing in newspapers all over the country, when it comes to the Louisville courier journal, in which we are talking about this article is, you know, he says his perspective on working at home with a computer, he also works at a at a computer company, but he's able to take his work home with him. And it's her perspective about him being in the house working at the computer. He says that, that he loves working at it, that when his computer magazines come in the mail he in this text, he rips them open with the same salivating company whether he does his Playboy magazine, and that he gets instant strokes from them. And it allows him to keep his mind alert and connected, and he really loves it. She says that it's worse having him at the house working at his computer than when he's not there at all. Because when he's working on the computer, it says though she isn't there. So it's like she's absent when he's there working on computers. But the only discussion that I know, the only discussions that I've seen about this kind of issue tend to come up either through individual voices, or through articles like this one that tends to talk about the problems between couples, and the therapeutic solutions for them. So in a sense, there's very little social discourse right now about human problems per se, in relation or social problems, the relationship continues until it gets to the point of interpersonal conflict, which is then tradable can make therapeutic. The council Unknown Speaker 56:52 what was Unknown Speaker 56:54 the political courage I think it was coffee. Women tend to be shown much less frequently sitting at video display terminals in their own homes. And when they are they tend to be doing the kind of thing and the place that they kind of are known to be in a kitchen, there's a pot boiling. She's doing something she might be doing by just turning the radio on anyways. As the floor is clean, she hasn't abandoned her household activities but from the consumer. This is my favorite advertisement. She's, she's with her with her almost a sewing machine like a computer and actually sewing machine like computer. She's sitting in a transcendent light, you know, I mean only only Renaissance painting placing a woman emanating the kind of glow that she seems. I really I think it's curious that that men are shown as having power in the world in these pictures and women are themselves made powerful. As though there is no work and as though just having it you know is it creates this emanation creates her power Unknown Speaker 58:27 adds mainly are aimed at men maybe once or twice at this stage. Yeah, that is correct. She has to make it part of women find hard women's nature and then I'll Unknown Speaker 58:38 be able to sell it to him. Unknown Speaker 58:40 I was thinking maybe that they know that women want nothing portrayed as a power in the world. It's like, it's like it's it is a body it isn't abundant. And that that localization that was incredibly awesome. That really does look like a sign machine. I mean, that's the message is in this ad is part is that that's light enough for her to carry it with no problem. And that's part of what they're you know, they're selling I mean, that's what makes them competitive. Oh, yeah. You know, this one. Unknown Speaker 59:23 And that made me but it's contextualized Unknown Speaker 59:31 in a definitely like upper middle class suburban kind of setting. While everyone else is waiting for the commuter train to come she's she's on the line. There's also some discussion going on in particularly in this article about how people who are opposed to home computers into working in their homes are silly Luddites are Infotec Luddites, he calls them because world is not so great today, this is one of the other arguments going on. Things are not so great at work and things are not so great at home. And maybe it'll be better. And it'll be different. And that just the fact that it would be different, is good enough for him. All of the author articles, and most profoundly is saying that computers will strike at the heart of our lives. And we'll we will be, you know, untouched by the minute. That is true in the finding remarkable ways of making that message. It was a full page ad in the New York Times for a new magazine that's coming out in September, called Family computing. Unknown Speaker 1:00:45 Now, you can only get the computer to change the Unknown Speaker 1:00:53 global family approach to the computer, the whole family community, you can be a better family. Which movie theater? And what's the idea of family Unknown Speaker 1:01:03 computing? Unknown Speaker 1:01:05 I've been wondering about it myself, but I think everybody's a family opportunity. Second only to the family Protecting. This this is this is this is this is one version of the family at home with the computer, everybody's in their own niche with their own electronic device. But you know, Unknown Speaker 1:01:35 well, well, first of all to house and everybody's got their own their own game. I don't know. I mean, I don't know whose house it is. Unknown Speaker 1:01:49 It's an extended household, which is something which comes up a lot in the, for instance, in this video texts and teletext in the US book, they say that people will be living families will be wanting to live with their parents or grandparents will be living with their children more, because older people will be able to do computer work, and therefore not be a financial burden on their on their children anymore and be a contributing member of households and so will be wanted within families again, because of their financial contribution to the household. That's another another aspect of the well, there definitely is more crowding, you know that for sure. That the strange thing about this notion of the connection between families and computers and what's called controlling your home with your computer, which is one of the most intriguing concepts to me, is it that notion first to think I've got some slides of it? Yeah, that's this article is about this man who lives by himself and uses this kind of technology in his house, to hook up his coffee machine and to water his plants when he's not home. So I mean, that to have that kind of mediation of the simple tasks that he has in his house, is really extraordinarily Unknown Speaker 1:03:21 costly. Machinery if you had to hook it up then to worry when we're Unknown Speaker 1:03:28 doing women's work, he also he also he also mentioned that he likes coming back to a house in which the lights are on the coffee's made and you know Unknown Speaker 1:03:44 it's been called controlling this appears in the in this many articles like like this appear in the in the magazines that are directed towards people who purchase computers and are trying to find new applications for them. It's not the kind of thing that pretends to be showing up every point. So this is probably the most important picture and the most important ad that as the main most important thing I have to say, because it really makes clear that for one thing, in all those ads are all the illustrations related to the work that someone is doing themselves. There was a kind of a fanciful attitude toward work. I'm like this ad which is directed towards the manager and his ability to control a home worker. He has a very realistic picture. She is neat and tidy. She looks just like she did when she was in your office. The house is not chaotic. Her child is there. And the the text explains how Lenny has created this So, this application of word processors called TELUS staffing, which brings her work to your office, but no longer her, and allows you to have greater ability to monitor her work without having her there. So that they know the numbers of keystrokes per minute. They know the numbers of mistakes, they know when you're off and on, of course, and the whole, the whole, all the anxiety issues for the lack of visual monitoring, are being solved from any Unknown Speaker 1:05:32 relationship. I have worked at home with a child. And that's an impossible picture is not real. Unknown Speaker 1:05:41 That was the best really a discussion question I wanted to ask you. Because in the experience of working in your house, Unknown Speaker 1:05:48 children don't like to have your attention waiver. You're in the same room with me damn. Unknown Speaker 1:05:56 So So you think that she might put her child in the next room and just close the door? Unknown Speaker 1:06:04 earphones on so you can hear the sound Unknown Speaker 1:06:09 in the ad, because it's not challenging Unknown Speaker 1:06:11 to comprehend what everybody likes, like. Unknown Speaker 1:06:15 It's telling you that everything is working at home, so don't worry about her being a home worker, when you have Unknown Speaker 1:06:22 a child and sees mommy in the room, and you can't have access to money, if it's like the wife who's neglected by the husband who's at home paying no attention to her, it's the same element here with the mother and the child, the child can have access to some of them individually, the old factory in every other way. But Unknown Speaker 1:06:43 surely our cultures elsewhere where women work and take care of children at the same time, I think it's the kind of expectation that children grow up with that now we're seeing children who are sort of entering the computer age at age five, seven, when their expectations already been set. But Unknown Speaker 1:07:03 it also speaks to a need for close analysis of the differences between computer work and other forms of household work, which in which you could be maybe sewing and also talking to someone, or kids could be helping you get it going to guards or other teachers that you know, cracking up. I mean, all those things you've seen pictures of and the different kinds of physical environment and social involvement could be put participating in Unknown Speaker 1:07:28 what you said how important the group would be to should work, which is, culturally when when you work in a time when the conscious mind is that they do tend to draw repetitive interruptible. So that the question I've not the child actually supersedes the labor process, which doesn't mean they weren't involved in their work, but they're not true people from here and will be Unknown Speaker 1:07:57 very important to the winning definition of how they make a balance. We're talking when you got anxiety, that keystroke monitoring. Obviously, it gives the illusion that a woman can deal with the child and forth in effect is a terrible contradiction. But the other thing is that it got kids into stuff, which harkens back to Don Haraway learning and partiality and gender and personality, you know, being Hertzog work and being inspired. This crusade is a different set of relationships about expectations between human beings and what it would mean to socialize children to deal with this stuff in their home if this stuff comes to dominate because we have a wage form where that woman has to make money so that she can bring up the same kind of kid who was you said before the kids if you need its mother to kill you Unknown Speaker 1:08:47 have no one else because the mother is alone without help in another culture you might have a group of children are able to draw Unknown Speaker 1:08:55 upon one another but the child is totally isolated and Unknown Speaker 1:09:07 dominates something about the nature of the personalities and children I don't know how now they will be we have internet I know why they Unknown Speaker 1:09:19 search almost finished pub intimate machines about children's relationships with with video games and computers computer game and she's she's read pieces of economist credibly good. She's really concerned with the way that children in particular are reflecting on the reasoning and the humaneness, which is probably the chairman as a kid or if you're ganna Sherry Turkle, she's a sociologist at MIT, and she's coming out with a book real soon called the intimate machine. And she's talking about this about the social context in which we're are wondering to what extent we're machines. And also the way that children in particular wonder about the personalities of these machines they're working with, they ask each other questions like, can it cheat? You know, does it lie? What you know, what they really are wondering about its, its so called intelligence. I'm wondering a lot about it. And she's found many kids who in moments of frustration, like tear up, break up these toys and try to find what's inside it. And there's no, there's it's not there's not it's totally okay. Yeah, there's no way of getting to its origin. And what that frustration leads to, I think it's thinking about themselves. You're talking also about at what point is that kitten sitting next to its video display terminal, how young and then the Unknown Speaker 1:10:50 class, which kids are going to learn it again. And California. So this news clips about putting the computers in public schools, really young kids, and I just think they're much further along with it than we are Unknown Speaker 1:11:02 in the Associated Press. Unknown Speaker 1:11:04 And what it really was was just to me about whether kids in different levels of schools are getting the same kind of treatment, the same kind of training, you know, there's so much in my mind that say high tech, and it's literally the limit, which can and whatever. Yeah, Unknown Speaker 1:11:17 I think there are lots and lots of issues with that. What are your tips for getting ready for this? preschoolers are not going to be disadvantaged by Unknown Speaker 1:11:24 wedding. Right? Sure. Well, and the argument, the thing that you said before about all that, what do you give up and we get it, and we make it so I knew somebody who had a computer and a kid and then waited to get all their digital stuff in their computers until after she had learned to tell time on a rapid clock. They had already thought out what she was going to miss about that set of relativity in time if they went into other digital and computing sensors. And that just blew my mind. Because, you know, I mean, a whole Unknown Speaker 1:11:54 lot of other things kids have to learn. Right? What was your vision or Unknown Speaker 1:11:57 exactly? Unknown Speaker 1:12:04 take things apart, yeah. Time sitting around that time doing Unknown Speaker 1:12:11 that notion of literacy. But there are other messages about computers in our lives that are being drawn and written about process world is not a magazine, it's as popular as Time Magazine yet. It comes out of San Francisco, it's sometimes you can find in St. Mark's bookstore, but not always. It's it tends to be exclusively about office work. I've been looking for people who would who want to do an East Coast version of it and talk about it. But there's many things that are awkward about I mean, that are directed toward we're working with videos or a terminal to these magazines they tend to be you know, kind of anarchistic approaches to the fact that there is no I mean unless the computer is down there is no natural break that you take when you're working at one I mean you don't have to get up and I don't know Xerox and come back you don't have somebody and you tend to be nearly motionless and just the physical stressors the anxiety Unknown Speaker 1:13:23 these are doable things Yeah. And they also respond to the people who are absolutely that limit Unknown Speaker 1:13:32 us we're down broke yesterday the world No, I would really like Unknown Speaker 1:13:45 to know more about these people the gun that you Unknown Speaker 1:13:55 why not? Maybe the switch is turned down Unknown Speaker 1:14:02 but it's more it's more like computers and it has it Yeah, yeah. That's always the city Unknown Speaker 1:14:16 fallible broken Unknown Speaker 1:14:25 like everything else in Unknown Speaker 1:14:26 the military like Ben was saying but you how would you Unknown Speaker 1:14:45 get this slide set, I wouldn't run away with it. Processed world Unknown Speaker 1:14:49 because um, I was on California classroom and also I think we used to work for them. And somebody told me that they were kind of nervous, but central all their group of people. Word, Unknown Speaker 1:15:00 generally unemployed, they write about them that they, you know, you can for $2 Each of these events you can get out of that Unknown Speaker 1:15:20 the end of this lecture, but I think there's a lot of room for, for expressing all the different ways that people are feeling about and thinking about computers in their lives, and that most of most of what we see about computers in particular is has is coming out of the narrowest imagination Unknown Speaker 1:15:43 like to connect with something I've been trying to get a handle on, which is, in what ways is this different than, say, the telephone? I mean, in some ways, it's obviously radically different. But earlier on, when we were talking about problems with privacy, and the possibilities of connection into connections, and, and the cost factor, I think my feeling is that computers are going to become accessible to most everybody as much as the telephone has been pretty soon, and maybe not five years, but soon enough for us to think seriously about because of the absolute phenomenal decrease in cost of microchips. And why didn't people maybe people did it when the telephone was invented, first introduced? Well, what happens is the government bugs, what how do you mean? Would they have had people telling them, telling them not to talk about abortion and lesbianism does that happen? I mean, Unknown Speaker 1:16:38 this cable telephone. For Unknown Speaker 1:16:41 me, every phone call that's extraordinarily Unknown Speaker 1:16:43 good is doing things like this, essentially, it was looking at stores, people were telling each other things that were being written songs that were being written about the telephone, in all the ways that they could try to understand how people envisioned it, only thinking about nothing. I've seen that rock, though, spoke about the kind of sense of threat that we're perceiving Unknown Speaker 1:17:05 is an issue there was rich, Paul wrote an article issue devoted to real culture and critical culture. And it deals with issues of privacy. Unknown Speaker 1:17:15 Because I love being recognized. Unknown Speaker 1:17:17 See, I don't think it's intrinsic due to the central corporate capitalist place where we're suddenly it's to do with the invasion of privacy over the last 1020 years. But it's suddenly a lot more aware of to do with blacklisting liberals and bugging people teleclasses. That's why we're much more. Unknown Speaker 1:17:40 Yeah, that's the I think, but I think that's, I think that's what you're Unknown Speaker 1:17:43 scared about it. But the fact that the Unknown Speaker 1:17:46 capacity exists to interconnect to cross reference to this level. Unknown Speaker 1:17:56 Issue, Jamie writes about social notice for use in transit, private and homegrown. stuff, I never thought of it as like a one on that. And that made me much more immediate, because I don't have to talk to other women, you know, and I feel like I saw some of my hysteria about this machine just in social discord. And doing it at home. Again, if Unknown Speaker 1:18:21 you were responding to the interactive program at the laundromat, they wouldn't be able to get any information about where you live, or your name, or who lived with you, or what you purchased today, or what you voted on. So that there is a wiki mechanisms in Unknown Speaker 1:18:36 what I've been looking at a rock word processor for the last four or five months. And I've never used one before. And there's two things that are striking me in this context, and thought much about one is that within a day, I learned how to write in public. And I'm a very private writer, I write by myself. And almost instantly I was sitting at this word processor with other people around writing in public. And I've noticed over time that my relationship to what I'm writing is changing. And it's becoming more. And I write again, in a second, but the other point I make is that I don't know what it was like before I got there. But I know that I'm pretty gregarious. And one thing I do is I make comments. I talk to the machine. And I talk to the people next to me, and we get into conversations. And there's a whole series of jokes and stories going on now that the lexicon machine lexicon is and we're all addicts, and we love creating one subculture in there. It's a very social environment, and we're having a good time. We love these machines, and we love working together. And in other words, I find that instead, what's been emphasized so forth is the way to privatize and isolated fragments or lines and then Planning making me as a more social worker, Unknown Speaker 1:20:02 you're not working at home, right? Unknown Speaker 1:20:04 I mean, we never work at home. But I can imagine like the laundromat analogy is neat. Like you could have neighborhood work processing groups who would save a lot of money to you know, one of your own equipment really you just more than just an actor that Unknown Speaker 1:20:23 want to share with somebody Unknown Speaker 1:20:24 you need somebody in your life at a laundromat to take care of it, Unknown Speaker 1:20:27 you get right on the seven plus super Unknown Speaker 1:20:35 lightweight kitchen, those houses have been fantasize before material premise. And, in fact, you know, bills and drawings and and they didn't, they didn't spread out and take over at all. I mean, I'm really excited about the laundromat notions, but I really wonder how we can push them to Unknown Speaker 1:20:53 really do it or we'd get our own, we get our own equipment and push the idea in public but not go there. People do not have a genuine perception that we can see in the ad campaign and your individual experience might be impacted on the positive way for some people, the general structure of how we live and work in countries is reinforced Unknown Speaker 1:21:17 at all. And they usually the self view is the lie that it is changing. Even though individuals can have to change that Unknown Speaker 1:21:30 tricky off about her it's reinforcing the private event at the same time that the impact is less Unknown Speaker 1:21:36 fire everywhere. Unknown Speaker 1:21:40 And in that time, also that you might come to stay in the home and private your time for long enough. So what does it mean that you're in your home when in fact, it's all completely like a circuit Unknown Speaker 1:21:56 lesson which one of the speakers said that the mix of individual and private space relates to being able to maintain control over people but I actually maintain an extension of my phone Unknown Speaker 1:22:17 so I see this whole nuclear family just that you've worked on her for Unknown Speaker 1:22:21 years to salvage the future. Unknown Speaker 1:22:27 As for something I was doing, and it was just incredible that all the projections are totally a new you know, a nuclear family they're also basically races to once in a while you see dark they do we complain but most of the time, not everything where he whatever kind of projection we're always we're always just have the other traditional nuclear family. But I don't think it Unknown Speaker 1:22:54 is right now. Families in America are catching Unknown Speaker 1:23:03 up to wages next. Unknown Speaker 1:23:06 Up to Idaho playing Unknown Speaker 1:23:08 a huge magazine is the wellness of the World Future Society and of North American white males over 40 But I don't know I mean, I did Unknown Speaker 1:23:18 it from whenever they started in the 50s or something 275 And then I updated it for an article you know, Unknown Speaker 1:23:23 very future so I went to AAA and and it was Unknown Speaker 1:23:27 well I was counting women I was counting a number of things but I also did a picture planning they also anytime they showed anything when they showed that that was something was up so we have new woman never asked the man for that much. But in terms of any kind of the future of some kind of different way of life, including technology, you just saw total replication of a nuclear family. And I see that too. And that's only some people Unknown Speaker 1:24:00 Yeah, well that's true. I realize that but I'm gonna have to do with no Unknown Speaker 1:24:07 idea but there are all kinds of other families Unknown Speaker 1:24:12 is anybody here heard about this family Opportunity Act before but I mean, I'm surprised that given the fact that it's there that it hasn't been very very widespread and talked about anybody right and curious about you know Unknown Speaker 1:24:38 I just I Unknown Speaker 1:24:40 find called Unknown Speaker 1:24:42 Snap I want to stress something except that as you started to some women in power and have some powerful You said they already work with power in the hope that we'll go back to this option as a to see that men started or did women. I go Along with Cobb Douglas, and I think we didn't know that was the place for there was no place for the gal who went to Yale, Harvard, Princeton, William and Mary had to go to the first part of the 19th century. So those women of middle class upper middle class households could have a high school education equivalent of their brothers married and then the home became their power center. We're not seeming to be able to do it. Certainly, Donna Haraway did say no one said, taking technology taking the computer and enlarging our sphere in the home, because the computer and everything is being directed by the male. And they are telling us to, they're in trapping us in our home and my understanding of the history of adoption of the two spheres a woman in the home as her Power Sphere, that we could, we could take it and make it not a trap, but make it Unknown Speaker 1:25:53 a freedom device. For all bras are increasing our freedom. Unknown Speaker 1:25:57 But we now we are more than 52% of the population. And so how well I'm saying you use that we work on our female Unknown Speaker 1:26:10 female spaces and male definition of them thing. No, so we are multinational corporations Unknown Speaker 1:26:17 with a different world. We're just Unknown Speaker 1:26:21 looking around to my question. But I'm curious Unknown Speaker 1:26:24 I mean, larger power to the point where I'm like, No, we're on Unknown Speaker 1:26:28 power. is missing the assumption? Well, I didn't Unknown Speaker 1:26:40 get I've had psychologists tell me, my mother was and I know. And Janeway has written a book on the powers of the week, and I described my mother to her before she has completed the book. Now, I said, it can be a Unknown Speaker 1:26:58 little confusing, to the extent that women have had power has been more within their houses than it has been Unknown Speaker 1:27:03 within a document. Unknown Speaker 1:27:09 But once something is carved out for you, and place where you must be, then you find three ways to do that. And a lot of the history of feminizing theory as done, it was trying to point out in my opening remarks that they are about the way in which feminine women want to be wanting to understand that domain and take from it something they could change the whole world with. None of us misconstrue the world because they already been oppressed by being put there as even existed as a separate world. It never was separate. And the whole ideological notion that there were those two things, the state that will use humane and will work and the whole litany turns out to be a moment, the 19th century ideology and production as a metaphor. And then our theories totally trapped in that moment. Within it, individuals and groups of women have found ways to be helpful, we think of Dorothy Dixon, and I hope that they are on the power of motherhood, to shake children. But nonetheless, it's within that larger sphere, which already need the definition and make the ology that keeps us. So it's like we're playing to play. I mean, it's just incredibly, you impressed by the connection to what you're doing is done and called for a Federalist technology today, and that we really like to think of ourselves as the beginning of a dialogue, we need to have with one another about what it would mean to say, is there a way to bring it home and still get home from it? Or do we only want it if it comes along in that one? I mean, that's a discussion we have. Unknown Speaker 1:28:43 How we hook into it? Unknown Speaker 1:28:44 Yeah, how do we want to look into it, so that all the aspects of Unknown Speaker 1:28:48 and shape the regulations here, and do Unknown Speaker 1:28:51 it in a way so that the issues read through that class and race and gender Unknown Speaker 1:28:54 or apart? Unknown Speaker 1:29:02 From one, and you don't have to get them out that they love that place that has been made you believe may find that they're not that place? They don't want to let go of it? And how would you explain to them how you are feminists and I can't get the message across. They much prefer that they don't see themselves as the victims of the male idea of the home. And they see themselves as very much a part of it and they don't have enough guts, and they don't have enough courage to break down. And so they don't want to lose that security. And then what about Ukraine divorces? And so you know that I'm going all over the place but I have difficulty selling feminism to my students. I just can't and they believe that they have a power that they're going to lose if they seek to do what all of us currently have done been doing for a long time. So I mean, this is the way I come across. This is what they this is the way they feel, and they see no need for Unknown Speaker 1:30:11 people seeking refuge refuge in their homes because there are real threats in the world. And it's nice Unknown Speaker 1:30:19 to think about the ways that we conceptualize the threat in the world, and the way in which we want cells and resistance in our lives, that it helps to think about that question you can see in science fiction, movies, and just all kinds of places that when we think about the threat being like on an from another planet, or, you know, extra, some kind of awful extraterrestrial invasion, that that home starts being the whole, the whole earth, you know, and then the we feel interconnected with each other in different kinds of ways. I think you need to keep thinking about home in relation to the rest of society and the ways that I'm impressed so far. I don't know if they can answer your question. Unknown Speaker 1:31:02 I'm concerned about the points that you brought up in the middle, which didn't surprise me in the least the survey of women who in fact are working in the home who listed a number of advantages, which were very important to them, in terms of being able to run their lives.