Unknown Speaker 00:03 The general system that anyone is curious is totally different than anything I've ever studied. So it's Unknown Speaker 00:10 a great panel, maybe will help me get to a we're going to this workshop will talk about textbooks socialization and social control. But I'd like to just interrupt the talking bitterness part of it, and start out with describing what we hope will be a liberating project. And then we will come full cycle again and come back into into the discussion that way. As I said, that three of us are working together on this project. And, and we've learned three of us the hard way come out, as those of you who mentioned teaching and changing your textbooks about the social controlling and socialization process that children go through if they accept the message in those in those textbooks. Camila has been a classroom teacher in the Bronx, and she has been alternative director has been the director of an alternative school called Shayla Mumba and Amherst, and she is now a doctoral candidate at UMass, and currently working on a dissertation step today. We push her a lot, except today, and it's hard, but she's addressing the problems of multicultural education. And barrel is a true hero of the public school system, having been principal of 201 during the decentralization battle, having been a curriculum person at the central board and leader of the Center on urban education. And now she's sort of taking it easy as president of the Council on interracial books working on this project during racism and sexism workshops for the regional destaque Institute's and also the teachers core. I had been a reading teacher and went right through the grades, and right through the up to the graduate program would be at Teachers College, at Brooklyn College at the City University, and barrel, I should say her Her research interests are written research, writing research interest has been on Layton culture, and mine has been on gender conformity, and reading comprehension. So we three have been immersed in all of the concerns that you expressed here too. Now, we are together at the Council for interracial books for children, but with their honest project, working on a project funded by women's equity educational act, and we call it M Burris and to stand for many basal readers with a third and fifth grade. And our intention is to develop the kind of readers that you will would like to discuss for what the third and and the array and the accompanying teachers manuals that goes with it. Now, the goal of the project is to develop materials that can be used to raise children's awareness of the needs for race and sex and disability equity, at least in their own educational program, and their own educational problems. And at the same time to increase reading competency. With this in mind, we're collecting materials for the readers and that have as a theme, social change, built right into the theme of the stories that we are looking for is the theme of social change. And the manual describes a curriculum, which we believe contains a feminist methodology. Because we have to teach children to challenge the ideology inherent in any piece of literature. And that they realize that lifts literature is or any written word really reflects the culture and the social system that produced it. And we hope that you know, we have a curriculum that will have them face the reading material. With that in mind, we are moving forward to their ability to make the decisions not to have to lean on the material itself, but to be able to make these criteria, discussion decisions. I'd like you know, just to start out by discussing a reading teaching model, and talk about you know, what has been the models existing. And just a little bit about our reading model that we hope to accomplish this. Unknown Speaker 04:45 Tamila will be talking about the processing that we've been going on in order to collect this material and barrel we'll talk about why these books and some of the problems we think we'll have if we try to get this book out into into the concerns She's going to get back to the talking bitterness part of it. All right, how do kids learn to read? Now there are explicit teaching models, and I believe at implicit learning model. Now sometimes there are creative, socially aware teachers who are cued into the learning model. And that is by their own brightness and their own creativeness and their own design and their own social concern. Because mostly, we will, in the reading business, and in the textbook business recognize that kids are taught to read by a model of teaching, not necessarily a model of reading, kids are taught to recognize certain words, remember, the old flash cards, if you resolve and, you know, recognize some words, and then to make materials that have these words, as part of and the and the, the emphasis is to discover that these words are then encoded that way, there's also ways that seem to be much more in stock at this point, which is the sound symbol relationship with sound out words, what is the sound like? What is the star? What is it do, and then reading instruction usually precedes a little what we call a language development model, that kids are really made more aware of the grammatical relationships and the textual structures of the material than really being aware of the meaning content back there queued into effect kids tied to the curriculum. But if it's tied to just reading courses, then that sort of gets lost except inherent in that particular material. So that teachers asked who, why and weigh up questions, you know, when you believe that they are really encouraging children to find meaning. But the implicit learning model rests really on a child's ability to construct meaning to really do that, that is meaning is really constructed from what is in the head, and what is in the page together. And a description of the process is formally embodied in what is currently cooled by cognitive psychologists schema theory. And the idea is that we have all of us many stored memories, you have a life before going into the classroom, or life before we read materials. And that is guides us to make an interpretation of new experiences and events. And these stored experiences are abstracted and generalize from specific episodes in our own lives. And these scripts in to help us to interpret events. And particularly if we talk about reading, described and written in written discourse, and that we store this new knowledge with the old knowledge, or we alter the old knowledge or reconstruct the old knowledge and we're really reading with some understanding. And again, this new information gets stored in our memory and becomes accessed. For instance, if I ask you, right now, start reading the biography of Janet Rankin. I say this because we've been working on January, because if I asked you to start reading the biography of the first congress, person, woman, a woman who became cable elected to Congress, you would start accessing because I said biography that you would be finding a birthday, or one when she was first elected, right? Well, I she was considered important. And you would start having this kind of form of model working in your head, you would also have some content model. I mean, if you knew Janet Rankin knew her pacifism knew that you'd have that. But without that even start Unknown Speaker 08:56 pulling out from your head, maybe a congress script so that you know what electing being elected to Congress meant. And this is, you know, the kind of thing you would bring through it and the kind of information you would get for it. Now, if you question as you read this, why today are so few women in Congress, if Jeannette Rankin made this big break full, like breakthrough and she was successful, you are then a different kind of critical reader, and is usually expected from this classroom experience. The experience that you would be brought to on you know, an other kind of reading methodology would be to understand the book, the message of the book, the way the author felt about the book. And this is the kind of plan that we are trying to evolve in our manual. We are trying to provide for the children a whole series of pre reading activities in which children can examine In the realities of their own lives, attitudes, teachers attitudes, their parents attitudes, or even maybe in a historical basis, certainly in their school life, what are the realities? Then whatever they're going to be reading, they will then be able to discuss with these questions in mind, how does this material really illuminate the kind of experience in reality that they know. And perhaps follow this with plant with an analytic discussion and action of some kind, and it's relevant for these kids. Now, our objective is to provide a curriculum active for these kids, that will help them to discover the kind of world they want to create. But beyond that, to understand the obstacles they'll have, as they tried to create this world, and that's a methodology that we have. Now you can do this with decongestant. And you really cannot do this with Dick and Jane spot, you know, and everything else. So having a little problem in finding this material has been our first goal. And I'm going to pass this on to Camila to discuss the problems that we've had in the processing that we've gone on, even to decide what this material needs to think. Okay. Unknown Speaker 11:23 One of the things that happened at the very beginning of this project, once we got the mandate is that we had to decide how we'll even begin to look into because where you look, has a lot to do with what you're going to get. So the approach to the Outreach Project is determined by the policy of the council and integration with the children. And that policy is to work with the groups that have been left out. In other words, you cannot have the more majority, right, the feminist basal reading. Okay. And even in the in the hiring process, okay. There was thought given to how do you bring together people who had insight, okay, into what the issues are for the various groups. So the council, I think, in a thoughtful way decided that understand that the people from very, very different backgrounds, who would look at at the knee in very different ways, okay, and embarrass her background in African American Studies and African Studies. And Ruth brought her background in dealing with issues of feminism, and also in being a Jewish woman rurale from the knowledge is interesting. And I've worked my background from the Hispanic culture. And we began to look at now how do we find silence? Okay, what do we have to do to even find the feminists who come from all of these backgrounds, okay, because historically, we've found that that you can get, you can get snapped very, very easily and repeating the opposite side of what's already been done. In other words, we don't like to contain. So the only thing that we'll write about is Dick and Jane and brown. Okay, but still with with the content, we didn't want to do that. So we decided that we were going to begin to develop some criteria for finding feminists and other kinds of feminists that we look for, in the circles of renewer, activist feminists. Okay, and we met, we met with a lot of different kinds of groups. And as we were deciding who we were going to meet with, we kept having what I call chakras, okay, a choke is when they hit each other, sometimes spawn flies, okay, now here are three women, all who have been active and whatever is important to them and their political realm. Okay, and we're coming together to put together this this was fantastic, new bass reader, feminist Face Reader. And we were having toolkits and deciding where we're going to look interior and what we should be looking for. And that was difficult in the beginning and occasionally got uncomfortable. But something began as that began to happen, okay. There was a new experience, okay. And that all of us in order to develop this new, this new type of basal reader for the 21st century, had to change by virtue of the fact that we were working together and trying to make these decisions to do we each had to change and I began to find in my own experience, that each stroke is each spark and that's the name of a project by the way and I was wondering how each spark Okay, make us think critically and others even at the age I'm the youngest member of the group, but you know, I've noticed Unknown Speaker 14:54 guess as you get into this thing of I know it all you know, my question is worse than everybody else's oppression. You know all your own history and you begin to get very comfortable in that place. But even at that point, we found that the staff and the counselor was wisdom and bringing this together, and bringing very different people together and allowing us to clash allowing for that, for that to happen, made sure that those clashes fought in a lot of different kinds of people. And I'm just going to mention a few of the kinds of groups that we met with, you know, just very broad category system we met with, we decided that it was important to meet with publishers representatives. Now, you know, sometimes you come in with, well, what do publishers representatives have to offer. And then you get into an argument about what kinds of people are in that field, and you begin to find out that these people, they have a lot to contribute, who in that field, and we met with people like on the ground, who's the Senior Editor for social studies, McGraw Hill, and began finding out some of the things that she was doing, we were met with very strong feminist in the State Department's of education. Okay, we also went out of the State Department of Education as we began to get into activist groups, very small activist groups that exist in little pockets of the city, we also left our offices and began to meet with groups in various racial communities in Asian, China, because it was too difficult to bring all of those people to where we were. And we began having those same sparks fly each time we went out, okay. And each time there will be a more enlightened entity, opening a new learning about what it is that people really want, because people are coming from very different places, we went out to Brooklyn, to meet with women of various races and cultures, the Congress of neighborhood women, and began to get a very different perspective of feminism from the women who have not been an African image not been answered during the rhetoric that they've been struggling with issues in their personal lives. And I just wanted to say, one thing that they told us to do was, we already contain right, and we were very, you know, they get talked about how alienated they will come to contain and didn't want to deal with it, what we want. And they said to us, what we want you to do is to rewrite the way, it really is, okay, with Piper coming home drunk, Mama, you know, Jane runs away from home, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, which are things that when we had had been having our little academic discussions in the office, we hadn't dealt with, okay, because whether or not we came from that experience, we had been removed from it. Okay, even by virtue of the fact that you're on Broadway, okay? Regardless of what ratio could you come from, is to some degree removed from it. So dialoguing with people who are still there, okay, that brings you home, that connects you that plugs you in that that sends electric shocks to be that make you think of things that you need to consider when you're putting together this kind of this kind of report. We also met with people who are educator activists and writers, illustrators, and we met with people from disabled in action. We met with people who were our mandate called for dealing with sex, race and disability. But other issues began to creep in dealing with ageism as a problem, and people kept bringing that and dealing with a lot of class issues kept coming up. So that, that all of us were enriched by this and, and brought it directly into the, Unknown Speaker 18:39 into the criteria that we were developing for deciding what the material should be. Once the criteria would develop, we sent out a call and we sent it out to organizations that were given to us, okay, when, of course, all of the groups that you can imagine, in the feminist circles, and we went into a lot of the ratio grassroots groups across the country, and we began to, you know, get material, Ben. Okay, the first material that came in as you most of you who have ever tried to do this kind of spirit is material from white people. Who were the first ones to pick up on these little things that appear in newsletters. And then we slowly began getting things from the Native American people from Hispanic people, from Asians, we have yet to receive material from disabled writers. Okay. We began getting initially a lot of things written outside of the group. Okay. And one of the items that are in our discussions with people in the community has said, You've got to write from things. So this is one of the things we hadn't thought about ourselves and thought about it that important home, you've got to write it from the side. And one of the elements that a lot of writers seem to have difficult to deal with is identifying with who they were writing about. A lot of things came in very broad. So then we began talking to people and say We have to wait. And this person doesn't have to wait like that the and a lot of a lot of the Third World writers would write about their own experience, but hadn't yet discovered how to write from inside the child. And that was another problem we were discovering, so that the problems became not only problems of political issues, okay, but we began to discover a lot of things about writing. And in our work with the reading specialist, okay, it became clearer and clearer and clearer that if you're going to bring in issues of critical thinking, which is basically what we do, okay, every story had to enable the childhood student, that the teacher and the students to think critically, that was the purpose, then the writing had to be very, very, very different than anything that that is really out there. Okay. It had to be a type of writing, it's very internal to them, in the sense, you could almost say, is political, and at the same time, spiritual in that there has to be a movement from the outside to the inside, which is a totally different way of thinking. Okay, and we realized that, that writers have not been taught to write that way. And one of the things that we're proposing now to some groups that are interested, is that perhaps we need to talk with white writers about things that has to do with race and class, and teach white writers how to write about various groups together. Because even though you get people who politically have made a commitment to race issues, when they write it still nothing, okay, it's still not there, because the experience is there, because we're still not living in a pluralistic society, because it is still not the culture of the people in the society in which we live to, to experience and identity that says that we can talk about the world the way it really is. Anyway, let me get away from that a little bit. The project staff continued to elicit ideas from these feminists and educators. And Unknown Speaker 22:04 what we decided to do was to look at the material that had already been published. And we found that there are some writers who have been doing that, within a minute like mythic ones. writers like there could can't do it can't go belonging, which is about the disabled, and as a writer was one and she wrote from inside, and she wrote very well. And we've had a good deal of success, although not as much as we would like with looking at things that have been published. But sometimes nobody knows about these books. So what our basal reader will be doing is bringing to the attention of a larger public, a public gets connected to the schools and what's happening in the classrooms, and what's happening in the relationship between the teacher and your child. A lot of these these types of writings that have begun to move in the direction of the methodology that Ruth is, is talking about, when all of this material is gathered together. Okay, we're going to send it back out to all these groups that we've consulted with and let them look at it and give us feedback. And then we're going to go through the selection process of pulling out with all the ready done that about three times, and the first time round up with nothing after we collected about 30 pieces, and we may wind up there again. Okay? Not quite, I hope not, I hope not. Because Ruth has been very, very busy developing her lesson plan. But when everything is gathered together and sent out to the consultants and brought back to us, we'll put it into a type form and send it to the schools, and teachers and students will be able to work with it, and tell us whether what we intended to happen is actually happening. And that's an important process, because that's not usually how curriculum is put together is a dialogue taking place. Because the relationship between the people who are gathering this material and the people who it's going to, and the people who are, who were writing it, once this many models tested in schools with the same kind of ethnic, racial mix as we had in our advisory groups, and it comes back and it's approved, it will then be put together and in a more commercial form and sent out to publishers, and people in the field practitioners, okay, will have a concrete piece of product that they can say this is what this is where our thinking is, a lot of times, publishers say we can't find that we can't find a group of writers, we can't find them as writers, so we don't know what you're talking about. So we're we're putting that together for people and saying, here's the model use it, you can either take material from here, or you can model your own materials after it. So that that will be one product. But the second and the most important product is the model that that we're producing in terms of the relationship that we've created among ourselves and the internal staff. Okay. I think that's a very important model and the relationship that we've had with the community that that we're in a sense Speaking for, and is actually speaking through the work that we're doing. And I think that's most important, because that ongoing dialogue is what the the struggle of the 21st century is all about. Unknown Speaker 25:14 Sure, I know we're not going to throw everything out because we have one belt, whether in our material, right? And that's fine to be. And we both say why can't everybody ride like they're the inside the Inside Out thing. It's why we're saying hamilo talked about getting out, and barrel is going to talk about coming out. Unknown Speaker 25:44 Oh, what we're really trying to do, in this particular piece of project development, is to break the cycle. It isn't any accident that you've had textbooks that have socialized women to accept inferior places in life. We go through a cycle of using materials which quote unquote, reflect the values of our society, which, unfortunately, racist, sexist, ageist handicap is in classes. People are educated and socialized and come out to be teachers, writers and publishers. And they perpetuate that the same kinds of materials in the 1960s. Those of us working very hard on counsel thought we had managed a breakthrough. When we began to persuade publishers to publish different kinds of materials, dealing with minority groups, what we found was that the publishers were producing more materials, but the materials were more dangerous, because they were more softly racist. We are trying to avoid that error. In this particular set of materials that we are developing. Case in point. Usually when I talk to people I say to them, women have been controlled and socialized to accept inferiority, by the strategies of omission. And permission errors of omission, errors of commission. And then I say to them, Does the name calculation mean anything to you? And those few who have heard of carry nation and strangely enough, is usually a male who responds. Have the vision of a wild die Vera Joe? aimlessly and relentlessly wailing away Hillary yawns at the cartoon? At lots of things, right, absolutely. Right. No way is it stated that caring nation had a legitimate grief. If she had lived in the 1960s, she probably would have been regarded as a creative Crusader. Because carrying nation was crusading against the havoc that liquor was wreaking on the family structure. And the liquor interest controlled by white males found it expedient to take this most justified rage on the part of a woman and DNA by making fun of it and making her an object of ridicule. And women accepted that they accepted this interpretation of an activist woman. Unknown Speaker 29:28 errors of commission home patches of history books, eliminating neglecting to deal with the way women shaped an era of history, by the force of their presence, the way they impacted. And I'm not talking about a one three list of women who made quote unquote, great contributions I am talking about way, women shaped and era and the way the events of history impacted upon women. I venture to stay by boldly without their contradiction, that most of the schism that now exists between white and black sisters, that should be united in the movement for women's rights would not be so short or so sharply expressed. If our history books had dared to deal with the periods of tension between black and white women at various points in history, and how these tensions were resolved, the points at which they were cooperations and the points with which they were disagreements, so that we know that there has been a historical basis for this, that history impacted on the white slave mistress even as it impacted upon her female slave. And this has never been discussed has never been raised as an issue. And that possibly lead to our present confusion, giving those who would control an extra weapon to controls with errors of omission and commission characterization. How often as a minority group momen been victimized by stereotypes, stereotypes races of the black woman that were developed immediately after the Civil War for the express purpose of keeping her in subjugation and controlling her economic destiny. But Earth Mother, castrating woman, the sexy promiscuous female, all of which internalized and fought by black women, and white women are like the Pocahontas stereotype with which the native woman is inflicted this flaw, hold on, quote, The Drudge of all work, the slinky dragon lady that epitomizes the Asian mother, she's here for Susie wall, or the dragon lady, or the sweet peach blossom, all of these functioning to impress the minds of minority and majority group women on life, the circle stereotypes, and by so doing, limiting very definitely their place into society, textbooks and trade books as mechanisms of control. And I think you've all familiar with the language. Person who was aggressive, but ambitious, in a negative way, when it happens to be a female. Unknown Speaker 33:31 But Oh, Unknown Speaker 33:33 David for the top, and those slim quantities of precedent, and the person is a male, again, sending messages, all of those noteworthy children's books that live out the women's place, as in the home, caring for family. And this is not to say that these are not valuable occupations. But these were the ways in which women were being taught to define themselves and value themselves, the rush to get married by a certain age. The projection of what I call the snow bike syndrome was or that ponies though syndrome, and will be on to the person who didn't have the long golden hair from back down. You see what happened if he was short, fat and brunette, or non European, again, the imposition of feelings of inferiority, these are the things that we are attacking, this is the cycle that we are trying to break. While now How valid is the claim that textbooks and literature, socialize people to accept them certain roles and positions. Well, research has already established that. So children begin by the age of two to have some vague intimation of how society defines people by race, sex, physical disability, and bye for the perceptions are there, definitely. And by the fourth grade, they are so hard that it becomes a monumental job to reintegrate and re educate these children. That's why we have selected grades three, and grades five, grades three to B's preventive grades by to be corrective and reinforcing. Very key grades. We also hope that those teachers who've been socialized to internalize these perceptions, will, by virtue of working through the material, go through some very hard internal processes, the trial by fire, as it may be, because a lot of things will be very difficult for teachers to lose, it's because of the nature of socialization. There is a very well known company, publisher of children's textbooks, who says I don't care who makes the country's laws, or writes the songs just let me publish the textbooks. And I've had the experience of the third largest producer of educational materials say to me, in 10 years, we will control teacher education, because we'll put it in the textbooks. And whether we like it or not, the textbook is really often the curriculum used in the classroom. We are now faced with a growing danger, that danger from the right. A person who probably defines herself as a housewife, is now running $150,000 operation, and is looking forward to a quarter of a million dollar building to house her educational review and Research Service and I'm talking of no normal gabbro of Texas, who has now become so powerful that a salesperson who does not get the company's book from the Texas LIS is in danger Unknown Speaker 38:02 of losing employment Unknown Speaker 38:05 is in danger of losing employment, so that now they are scrambling madly in the publishing world to produce Texas quote unquote, beauticians. Lola gabbro is diametrically opposed to everything that she we all about. She is death on humanistic concepts. And in each piece of our materials, we have identified such concepts you've identified the humanistic concepts to be explored. And you've got identified equity issues to be addressed, including sex harassment on the job. Unknown Speaker 38:54 As the normal gamma feels that home, Pa and family are under attack by the feminists that we are departing from the traditional values of American life. And I say You betcha. If the values of American life are sexism, racism, anti capitalism, and as you can see, we are departing from those values. Those happen to be the values on which this country was founded. Those were the values kept in place by mechanisms Unknown Speaker 39:40 of Unknown Speaker 39:41 control, which service by the educational institution, protect you godly men and godly women and define traditional roles. We We are about breaking down these perceptions of traditional roles and low role occupations for men and for women. Thank you that is what you're about, which places us in opposition's to norm a dabbler normal Norma Campbell says that we are about destroying the family. Because we are Unknown Speaker 40:29 asking that the Unknown Speaker 40:31 roles and relationships between men and women be looked at at different grades. Normally gambler except for very well finance to mount a very determined opposition. Where is this financing coming from Jerry Falwell for one because it's inconceivable that normally gambler working from her kitchen, but suddenly mountain off an operation with a budget of $150,000 and even begin to project the kind of magnificent tower to reaction that she is now protecting Norma Gamble is also financed by the D A. who see in her the protection of American values. Normal gambler is financed by the John Birch Society. Normal gambler is also funded by a group of businessmen who believe in the free enterprise system. So it all comes together with a new emphasis on re establishing the power of the family. The power of the military, and support of the economy for which the free enterprise system the freedom to exploit women to do away with the protection of child labor laws to do away with laws which would protect women from being abused and children from Norma gavlak. And her allies have come together behind the Family Protection Act, which very specifically would prohibit federal funding for projects such as ours. For any project, which would fund educational materials, who specifically aims to redefine the traditional role relationships between Unknown Speaker 42:58 men and women. Unknown Speaker 43:02 In the publishing world, the bottom line is profit. And if Norma Gallo and her allies can succeed in having books knocked off the list in Texas of the politisches are going to toe the line and they do they now submit scripts to look at my blog is like yes, I'm telling you, or her input, review, suggestions and comments. She is quoted as said she was slave at the adoption hearings, and she is sent for as a one woman Flying Squad. In places like often soul of your home or wherever folks are about to be adopted. So you see again, that they forces are aligned against us in terms of eliminating the progress we have made. However, all is not lost. Because even normal gambler admits that there will always be alternative presses at that material such as we project and materials such as those produced by the Feminist Press will always be produce. And I think that this is where we have to face our poll. On less. We as a group can organize sufficient numbers to make a dent in the publishers revenue. You will not be able to cope with the millions of dollars that's being poured into the coffers of people like normal gambler, because her arguments are specious enough to attract people who should rightly be on our side. Particularly for economic quality, it makes a lot of sense to a poor woman who was tired of working as a domestic at substandard wages, to have somebody say to her, your husband should have a job that would enable him to stay where they would be to stay home, and he can keep you in comfort, that's a really attractive it's a most attractive argument with somebody that has to go out and work as a domestic or an unskilled. I was saying hold like a lady. Right? Or those women are out to get your job, they are the reason your husband is not employed. And whether we like it or not, those are most attractive arguments. And we have to recognize that and we have to target those women, that those arguments are attractive, and re educate them to the real danger and who the enemy is. Unknown Speaker 46:33 Think we're going to give you all a chance chance to talk. And I think one of the questions that that we have put out is, you know, is our concern about material. And you know, and you've all come in here and talked about your concern the material, and I think, you know, if we can talk about the concern, and the other side of the concern, you know, what do you consider, you know, the kind of material that you think kids should be out there for kids, you know, in terms of, you know, what what should be developed, or what we should be seeing in terms of the classroom. I know, the Feminist Press is being is gone a new project, maybe you might describe it to a little bit to us, Lauren. So just in terms of you know, of, of the concerns that people have brought to you in terms of library concerns, I think it would be interesting for people to Unknown Speaker 47:26 know it's not altogether a new project, we wouldn't be here though, we got some money from Iraq, Unknown Speaker 47:33 to do for middle school leaders, Unknown Speaker 47:39 what we had done a picture book some years ago, that was to develop a critical bibliography of books that were good with, according to guidelines that went down sectors, basis, class by ages, ages, not non stereotypical books. It was rather nice, really obviously happens now and a second printing books today, she'll she'll write an annotated with a guide to picture books. And they were recommended, not so recommended and unconnected Unknown Speaker 48:18 to the category, Unknown Speaker 48:21 then, we did the same thing with the Rockefeller Family Fund wasn't 300 books with the four children between for between eight to 11 to 12, produce the bibliography and then globally, we're just about to publish still without me and then again, think about how could we be something more than that we are happy we begin to work with teachers and librarians so that the concepts to which we look at the books and decide good, bad or indifferent, become part of their discrimination. So that they the teachers, the librarians and parents begin at least in some subtle way to influence what looks good for folks to get through. And then eventually, how do they influence the reading habits of the children and associates who are going to remove good bad indifferent books from the shelves. So find the intervention process and really highlight for us in a different time Catholic schools to grow representative checks in Kenya, to the people instead of education. This is good news. Video, you're sending out a quote shortly for two teachers to do the teacher workshops. The teacher can A librarian has seven sets and face workshops and sessions with people still as well, as a group of co sponsored by the test. Well, we are hoping that we're going to get into things, it's going to evaluate it as opposed to those that owns a piece of it, and will disseminate it, perhaps to teach whatever we learn Unknown Speaker 50:29 about models and strategies Unknown Speaker 50:30 for doing this work with teachers, librarians, parents, who are currently working with the children were adopted in our second year music National Library to pass another part of their own staff development in the city. Unknown Speaker 50:56 I think you know, the interesting thing that that we've been seeing, in terms of textbooks is the appearance of change. If we now look, look at these stories, and they have, you know, that different colors, they've got a tinge to talk about my sister who is deaf, they talk about, they talk about the neighbors, they talk about all kinds of families, other families aren't like your families. And, and as we got more and more immersed in this, you know, it's really as barrel set, it is so subtle, because it establishes a norm, even more firmly than the story of omission in some way, my family is this way, there are others that are different. I am fine. My sister is I mean, it is a very, this is. And when when Camila talks about from the inside out, it became self aware to us as we were walking around and talking to these groups of what this did, not just to make them feel left out. But to make them feel that there was something wrong with them. I mean, that to us was really the most upsetting thing, the abuse child and child, we can't wait. And so every other family has love has this. And that, or, or the Asian woman who said, I watched these people kissing each other and hugging each other on television, we didn't do that in our family. Therefore, there was something wrong with us nothing to validate other forms of communication. It was the you know, the mainstream communication and the mainstream concern that's going on three points. Unknown Speaker 52:36 As part of this submarine force has net jobs. It's what I call the school's creation. World, the black children let the sons and daughters of the neighbors go nuts. But Mr. Mrs. Bowman is a beautiful senior White. Unknown Speaker 52:58 Now that's that's exactly what has happened, not only in illustrations, but even in the content of stories. The changes that have been made are very, very superficial. And that's the problem. We've been finding that even people who should be writing differently or not because they're writing for the commercial market. And have people haven't quite thought through what is the vision of the future that we want? And how do we write about it? I mean, this is an issue that has come up in our profit how do these developers be wanting Unknown Speaker 53:34 to recognize is many of the writers who had experience sex it was really ordeal for me because their perceptions of themselves and their experiences of being in terms of what the establishment has told us they have difficulty not even knowing that that has been said or how they can deal with rows that were was that the teachers the teacher must feel Unknown Speaker 54:17 with that kind of an inside out. Unknown Speaker 54:21 Then they will be taught to be the voice of establishment rules of conduct. Unknown Speaker 54:29 We were the good girls. That's why we went to teaching say we're Unknown Speaker 54:31 going okay, we're going to work and not having that. Unknown Speaker 54:37 So called typical family Unknown Speaker 54:39 at the same time that they Unknown Speaker 54:41 were teaching their kids the pupils Unknown Speaker 54:43 that it was Unknown Speaker 54:49 on visitors Unknown Speaker 54:53 but also as a student because of the Window Dressing intended for ventilation. So when it came down in that there had to be compliance Board of Education, some new kind of funding. So they managed the public's publishing, saying, we need this kind of material and dry lips were snapped and didn't know where to go to find stories and materials that were affected and that liquids in their makeup. And then they published the material, and even stuff that was really addressing couldn't get to schools that really needed because it was those communities that have ordered new textbooks that have been money that could even see any of that change. However, those school districts in Blackboard are areas of children. And we know that that could feel the impact of that most can feel it because their school systems couldn't afford to buy new textbooks. And they have to have, you know, all the old material that they had to grapple for. It's strange for me just take anything on students. And to get the audio visual, which are also Unknown Speaker 56:15 unabashedly for a living. Unknown Speaker 56:19 It really is a very sad situation, because even those kinds of materials are being developed. Because it is such a profit oriented business and education really is unfortunate that we see it from the outside. You see that those schools that need the most will not be the schools that are able to audit those materials in those cases. And that scares me into I don't know, how it can be offensive, so. Unknown Speaker 56:58 And the social programs that were gave the possibility they are buying it like the Thai one, which went to the educational and poverty areas. So they are now being disbanded. I mean, there was a chance really that those schools might even be first to get them. If we had a real effect, we had a real equity situation going and title one was really used in a way that it had been designed to use. And now we're even going to lose that. But I think that a comment. Unknown Speaker 57:27 But then HW did sponsor a program where they tried to get teachers consciences raised and hold workshops and tried to promote stereotypes been broken. But again, it was unsuccessful. Because when the workshops were done, the teachers not really absorbing what was being said. And because of their own talents, their own conditioning, their own psychological makeup, were not able to receive that message, and then transfer it into their classrooms into their students with socialization. And not only that implication in their own content areas, but about what women had been by, in history in and bringing attention to them and saying, Look, you know, if I'm a science teacher teaching astronomy, it wasn't an impartial who discovered the content. It was his historic Catholic. I mean, that's revolutionary, we've had to make a statement like that in your classroom. But even if they knew it, and they didn't know how to make that kind of information, no, they had to go back not only in their own consciousness as a human being, but they had to go back in their academics to relearn a great deal of research, because it was Unknown Speaker 58:54 just want to mention one thing about just the school. One of the things that that I think the council has found out is, you can't send all those teachers back for complete retraining. But when the justice for I believe it was this one, curriculum was put out by the Council, the teachers who used it went through the process of trying to, you know, turn training as they began to use it, because and gave feedback to the council that they learned a great deal from using and I think that the expectation is that was something like this, once it gets out. If it gets out too loose, maybe that that same process will will take place with Unknown Speaker 59:38 the people who use it. I just wanted to Unknown Speaker 59:42 to reinforce the point that there will be Unknown Speaker 59:44 problems. Unknown Speaker 59:48 We should be aware that all the major publishers in the United States now have been taken over by the multinational they control all On television, Telstar, telephone, publishing, books, magazines, radio, everything so that when the CEO, guide or board of directors, the chairman says, These are the ideas we want to see, all the way down the line targets on television, radio, publishing books, education, he will be the one to decide what our children need. And thank you. And the media. proof that this is so effective is the fact that what we see on television, or the way women are portrayed, especially on television, is goes unchallenged. That continues, there's even with the feminist movement, there's absolutely no change of how women are trade. African Americans, people of Latin American descendants. And then we have to recognize this is a very formidable enemy that we have. Out there is a publisher out in California called bootlegger crests. They have published a book called Where Have All the publisher has gone hand in hand in this book. They described very vividly names of corporations. And book publishing companies usually control at this point, for instance, RCA, CBS, Sunday, so forth, so that, say about 25, or 30, major multinational corporations are controlling everything that you see Unknown Speaker 1:02:06 here. And think about Unknown Speaker 1:02:11 the situation in Texas, as you pointed out, that it's getting tighter, because it's being cold. Unknown Speaker 1:02:19 And I just want to share one experience that we had in Copenhagen, when we ran a, a workshop, some something like this on on on sexist and racist images in basal text. And we expected, we expected to get an American and English audience just from what you were talking about. And we had all of these Europeans and African people. And they told us that they cannot afford to compete with the multinationals in terms of publishing picture books. So they buy the plates, and they translate the stories, but these picture books, you know, the picture line holds so strongly that they're going to repeat the images. So they had a tremendous vested image in the American feminist movement of how we were going to affect change in these picture books, which was, you know, fascinating, because we know there was so many exciting things going around. We were kind of surprised to see all these people coming in on on that one. Unknown Speaker 1:03:21 It just made me think my second assignments in my fifth day using the little bonus that they protect Mr. extorting it's written in Eagle, Denmark or Sweden. And it struck me because a little boy was talking about Unknown Speaker 1:03:35 Indians and how they should all do that. He was like, oh my god, this is terrible because he had the Danish and he had reinforcing the same stereotypes we have because that's why Unknown Speaker 1:03:45 because it's one of the reasons the right picture. Unknown Speaker 1:03:50 Because people are sending somebody new, you can find more or less sexy sports for Scandinavian children. To see more. Unknown Speaker 1:04:02 We did pick up a wonderful little book of poetry. That was sweet. Yeah, I Unknown Speaker 1:04:08 am, I am me. Unknown Speaker 1:04:11 And I can tell every honest translating Unknown Speaker 1:04:15 what we must not underestimate the power of the multinationals and I select when we went to the book fair in Frankfurt, two years ago, Robinson Crusoe Little Black Sambo, they had 10 little niggles I had 10 illegals going everywhere but to the moon in in series one and then then terrible they just didn't think of it yet so maybe they may be fine now they've got they've got the moon but they had them on the beach. They had them all over the world, but everywhere, but she was going to the moot similarly 10 little 10 little Indians. There is a strong movement though in the Scandinavian countries against sexism and now against racism because we have been in contact with the leader of the movement, the country has Unknown Speaker 1:05:08 come together and Sony, Unknown Speaker 1:05:11 the big the international multimedia companies are I mean, they're connected phenomenon that they affect you trade books and training Unknown Speaker 1:05:22 industry. And to some extent we're aware of that. Unknown Speaker 1:05:25 I think that when people aren't aware of what Campion's going up with the power of the state education departments in tech, right? Immediate, the big company, whoever RCA is printing for the State Department of Education, it isn't so much that it's deciding it's printing for them. And I think Unknown Speaker 1:05:49 it's printing for them. Because profit, yes, dollar profit rather than principal. Yeah. Unknown Speaker 1:05:56 Awareness, either its parents and just political people of where the children's texts come from, and who by yourself, and how many millions of dollars are involved. And why Unknown Speaker 1:06:09 it comes to the international Reading Association, you know, how many millions of dollars are involved in teaching? They already, it would be it's a painful experience these meetings, these meetings is held always in a coliseum where a full size of the Coliseum floor is used as a display for publishers material. So you've got to know the influence the interaction influence that goes on and the Unknown Speaker 1:06:36 way I'm trying to deal with it, in the next couple of years, is accomplished. And with the lack of materials in schools is really requiring Unknown Speaker 1:06:54 such books as you can use for things I did my father Unknown Speaker 1:06:59 was a very nice one to get to New York State on and you are dealing with Carson, anytime you read that over and over again, you get talking with legislators and have your segmentation different in people to give you a map or like some of you that are with us. remind you to take my word for personalization. The other is it the question if we gave you access to your likes to prevent others from. But I do certainly know that it's the political or political arm right now to be honest with you, the law provides a mandate and the mandate for that the network of people who had to develop within the staff have some strength and recourse for when they will take a certain standard discussion of how to deal with it when dealing with it and writing up the law you should have a good grasp next, Unknown Speaker 1:08:25 human rights to come up with Unknown Speaker 1:08:26 will be to require in the aggregates as a de X. There must be nonsenses registration number, the new books will be purchased by August at some point. And what they're asking for is that overall, if they don't ask for establishment of a commission, which one of the first few books really and look for some of that? Oh, forest, I'll defer to you. Unknown Speaker 1:09:06 Perfect. I was just going to say that it's been such a walk in New Jersey has Unknown Speaker 1:09:16 been quite successful since Unknown Speaker 1:09:19 professional radio to New Jersey. I'm not a tax lawyer depending on Unknown Speaker 1:09:29 the difference between working with Jersey and New York Unknown Speaker 1:09:35 is astonishing. Who knows who Unknown Speaker 1:09:37 difference to the fact that there is law in such a void there is an office and money and so forth. And they're very concerned in Jersey about the fact the federal funds the drying up of federal funds. They're not very careful in the block grants. They will be out but not very carefully monitored. And don't underestimate them. They won't be able to do so effectively for eight or nine years in New Jersey, they have quite a few programs that have made the difference, not just advice from me, I think we have to go up because wonderful would be important. But what matters is not even so much. I suppose saying Thou shalt not as a real educational program, to what it is held equal to do what it is you want done, because you can say, Thou shalt not lie. And yet you're dealing with human beings who have been socialized, who had full jobs who teach something well, meaningly, where the racism is unconscious, sexism, internalized. So totally at 40 years old, they've always lived this way. It's a long struggling process that we have to prepare ourselves for in stages. NIDA, if you've ever heard her talk about this, absolutely fantastic. Because she went into this with a plan in her head for 10 years of working with 500 different third tiny school districts in New Jersey, it's a small state, everything's great back then. But they have a structure that was possible to create accounting structure. So she had layers of hierarchy to work through. And she, she knows what can be done in what is still hopeless. And yet she doesn't finish don't get discouraged in doing. But it is very, a very long process is a wonderful first step. I just, I'm just being responsive to you. And what I really want to say to this group is that what Darrell is saying about what we're up against is in many ways, staggering. And I'm going to be able to very short to center those Gration on the shore. In fact, we have this project, which some of you know that it's a high school project with the new slides, things were finished after seven years, and it's co published with McGraw Hill, I just began to get some data about their sales analysis. Originally, they had all the markets. And we would have to produce the books, including the design artwork, right up to the film, and they simply don't print. And they come to us their best efforts to distribute our books, Unknown Speaker 1:12:24 which is not only anticipating what you think, Unknown Speaker 1:12:27 well, it's very upsetting, and also heartening. It's so crazy way your distribution. We have numbers now I'm not releasing them this is you can spread the gospel. We're not doing very easy to release numbers. After 18 months, and schoolbooks were out for the whole period of the 18 months and two books were out only for the last period of fat. So it's really less than about a third because there's 12 books in the series. The Feminist Press sold 29,000 books, was working on sold 3200 shows I'm not releasing because we haven't checked. They keep their system one way we keep our system another way I have to do some cross checks to make sure that that's really exactly that was my guest by the way, the people selling 10 times as many as they want. They have the mass High School mark which is more the other markets away from them almost as soon as we began when we realized the quantity they were ordering for the college market. They were going to order 300 books a year squadrons we have a little Feminist Press and of course never order less than 3000 the bending event and of course we sold 3000 to justify that and we ordered the first four books let me tell you who the black format which one they want to be brought that book right from Unknown Speaker 1:13:53 start the best way Unknown Speaker 1:13:57 by the way that looked at the sales figures of the 29,000 that leads the rest by far and he was worried and I had this thing with the guy I had to work with the people. They work with sportsbook would be the best course in sales and even for us it's before us and we know why we don't have any way of marketing, special books and for us for the special wears black polos is like all other other books in a sense, either our folks tend to be in fiction or Unknown Speaker 1:14:26 have another theory of why your sports isn't going which I'll share with you wish was Unknown Speaker 1:14:31 that at any rate, the sports is the worst and the black one is the best. The other two books and the first among the first four were the anthology that I did was working and performer book rights and wrongs. Now that's the focus. We're going to take the words and it's very conservative, and that's because that focus by Frank on the right to Cooper over on the side. That's the Unknown Speaker 1:14:59 chapter It also gives activist information very how to say action. Are you all of them? Well, I Unknown Speaker 1:15:05 have the only I use the word very, because they're Unknown Speaker 1:15:08 an active verb rather than a passive coming down Unknown Speaker 1:15:12 to view. So I have I mean, the reason I use it is that in their publicity, that is the book that got lost, they got left out accidentally illustrated Unknown Speaker 1:15:22 3200, or even that magnitude of mobile suggests that you had to do something active, passively would Unknown Speaker 1:15:29 have been better. If the people in the Sales Promotion Department. Have you talk to them? Unknown Speaker 1:15:37 Well, yes, I certainly will Unknown Speaker 1:15:38 not ask him why he hasn't probably I mean, what they do right Unknown Speaker 1:15:44 now, if they are racist, they are some males, friends, and so forth. They have the power, not to provoke the symbols, is determined that you see it by people who isn't I mean, I don't Unknown Speaker 1:16:00 think they want to spend it. If we wanted to do a lot of careful political analysis of the way this particular microcosm of that whole world, the pharaoh was describing works, it really is very complicated. It is not just, you know, them out there sitting in some room figuring it out, they don't have to, because the people who work inside an operation as big as McGraw Hill, have their own bushes in Palo Alto Graham is there. But so is the man who directs all of this is going to live right turns out with SDN, and this project is protecting him, and allowing him existence allows him to do other books. And once the feminists have worked on this project, before, he'll have staff turnover says no one lasts more than nine months or 12 months, and we've had wonderful feminists in and out of it, like this respect, just get to know, to work with someone and boom, she's gone. And it's very complicated, but how has that worked? Who has Unknown Speaker 1:17:07 left? See, and I think, you know, we have to face face the problem, though, you know, teachers by nature, their profession on the most hopeful people in the world and believe in change, the fact that they've landed up as teachers, you know, that means that, you know, more or less they've accepted a kind of socialization role. I mean, I think it's, you know, it's a very interesting point to make, that the one professional organization that the era did not get into us was by the national teachers, organizations, and many of them, I mean, they do have, you know, one foot in part of the system and the other foot outside by the nature of their occupation, their part time occupation, their being able to, you know, provide for the family, within a family context, you know, and that's, you know, the problem that we face at the same time, that's we appeal to their, their hopes about hope, belief and change. Unknown Speaker 1:18:04 Yeah, I would just like to make a point that I don't think we have addressed enough. And I'm responding to be suggestion. We at the council long ago came to the conclusion that we have to face certain realities, that in many instances, school districts, were not going to be able to change the books that they already had in their possession. So it was up to us to teach the uses of those books to the children, parents are teachers how to use these disruptive materials in a constructive way. So that we made it our business to equip them with those skills. And we sold our procedures by emphasizing that we were providing a higher level of education, because we were emphasizing the development of the critical reading skills of the students a critical reading skills and critical thinking skills. courses, students had to evaluate, compare and make judgments and draw inferences. And we were also providing information that stored up to very large gaps in teachers information. And many times, we found that it was very difficult for teachers to accept new information because it was not in the book. So at the same time, we had to work with children to get them to challenge what was on the printed page. We also had to work with teachers to get them to release this dependence on the printed page. And I don't think we can do one without doing the other. While we're about getting the new books, we've got to deal with those that are already in place. Unknown Speaker 1:19:54 And even in our development of these materials, which we consider that we'll pick And to the best of our knowledge, these are going to be the best. But as someone made the point of nowhere, peeling off the layers of the society and understanding more and more, what is patriarchal, what is sexist, what is racist in the society, and what's going to be true for this year, might not be true for next year in terms of the values we want to talk about. So as I said earlier, that, you know, we see as the challenge is to develop these kinds of readers, which will challenge the ideology in which the material is written, not just, you know, make choices about reading, but be able to challenge these ideologies and understand that things no matter when they are written, there will be written within a social context, that Humpty Dumpty was written at the time of the breakup of the British Empire. At Jack, the beanstalk was written at the time when the little white man was viewed by following following the black, you know, the native app there. I mean, I think you know, that that's what we consider the most important challenge. It's not just getting the materials out there. But trying to teach kids to get to understand this. Unknown Speaker 1:21:02 Yeah, I just teaching, and I found I was teaching fifth and sixth grade classroom student teaching there. And I found the students are very aware of the sexual discrimination and racial discrimination in textbooks that they do use, because I was working with specifically with me just using a reader. And I really think it's that bad. I mean, I was using it tested a bunch. And they said to me, they said, You know, I mean, they can't relate to the children in the stories anymore, because more than half of them have mothers that are working, and that just doesn't exist, and a lot of the stories, and they just they haven't, they have this difficult time with the books, I think, as you know, as we as people looking at them as resources have, and I, you know, it's so necessary, and I was pleased to hear that fifth grade was one of your, you know, core grades concentrating on because at that point, the students are aware that, you know, certain things are not existing, that aren't there. And, you know, in terms of meaning you don't want to be, and they know that they're frustrated, because it just doesn't relate to them. And then there's nothing that's going to change. Unknown Speaker 1:22:27 But you must be a good teacher, if you gave him room to say this, to hope you stay with the profession. Camila has the last word. Unknown Speaker 1:22:40 Well, my last word has changed. Because it's obviously ended the time, right, I was going to give people here one of the small products of the Council, which is 10, quick ways to analyze books for racism and sexism. And also, I'll just pass these out in two directions at once. We also have a catalog that contains information on how you can order various products that the council puts out, the council has been working on these issues for 15 years. And all of the groups that exists that we know about the council history have spent time meaning so that that dialogue that's been taking place over the 15 years with various scripts is documented in, in this type of material. So if you aren't aware of it, of what has been done, and what is being said by Native Americans, Hispanics, disabled Asians, and other people, we can, you can check it out in here. So useful tool. And I'll pass out some of these catalogs for people who would like to, I only have a few. But you can take them. And if you don't get a catalog, you can give me your name. And I can send you a catalog. I can also send you a description. I'm including them of project Ember equity models for beta readers, because we are still looking for materials. All right. Some writers very kindly had been working with us the seagull, and some materials that come in and we think that that that we can use it. We assigned people to work with that writer to develop that a little bit further so we can get it to the place that we want. So if you know a writer or our writer yourself and would like to attempt to fill some of the gaps that we still have in our project, give me your name. I'll send you the criteria and a description of project and Unknown Speaker 1:24:32 have a stop. We have a sign up. We have a signup sheet. Thank you very much.