Unknown Speaker 00:01 Now let's see if it's working. I don't know if I have it in life, but it seems that way. field, which is listed over here also rules about what you would like the workshop to address. I'll start off by saying my name again, Nancy. Unknown Speaker 00:36 I'm in psychology, but I relate also to sociology. Sociology into linguistics, I'm about to say. And I'm identifying myself as convert from University of Law and from the publication state of mind. And I'm most interested in talking about making feminist scholarship work accessible outside of scholarly channels, that is to to women who are not in academia. That's a two way street, actually. But here who's talking about making our scholarship accessible to them. There's also a backflow from that. So that's of interest to me, but I want to hear what's of interest to other people. So Introduce yourself. Unknown Speaker 01:25 I'm Kathy Lerner. I graduated from Barnard. And I was hoping to sort of cross class and racial lines. And I think that somehow, scholarship doesn't always do that. So I'm interested in learning better how to Unknown Speaker 01:45 involve sociology. I'm interested in making the disciplines itself, reflective of our daily experience. Unknown Speaker 02:00 So I'm almost more interested in the other part of the flow that you're talking Unknown Speaker 02:07 about. Undergraduate sociology coordinator, Unknown Speaker 02:14 the winner Center. Unknown Speaker 02:18 In terms of accessibility of knowledge, Unknown Speaker 02:20 I'm concerned about number one, the different ways that one can make the academic structure more permeable, in terms of letting that knowledge get Unknown Speaker 02:33 to a lot of different departments. Unknown Speaker 02:36 And number two, and getting it to, as you say, people outside without really seemed to have a leg to stand on, in the computations that are involved in the daily lives. Unknown Speaker 02:51 And we all need, it seems to me the negative agenda. But also, you said that causing class and racial bias is extremely Unknown Speaker 03:08 interesting. And one of the things I like to eventually do is write for the social sciences in general Unknown Speaker 03:25 policy studies here, this whole social background, I did not pick this workshop someone told me to get here, the place and I did not differ come with any preconceived notions, but I'm immensely interested in applications of social science. Unknown Speaker 03:47 On one hand, in terms of women's knowledge, of the work that's being done in academia, I'm concerned about the fact that a lot of Unknown Speaker 04:02 presentations that are made seem to come off of law a and not use the work that's being done. So there's issues of how you how you build on the knowledge to make it a tool for people who are not. Unknown Speaker 04:20 on Capitol Hill, I'm the director of the program on limited Northwestern and I'm also the editor of social problems, which is a sociology journal on the tiny circulation, but some small review in sociology, and I'm interested in two things. One, since I am by temperament a wheeler, dealer, and hipster, I'm interested in just how you do get information around in networks and how information triples around as it were, like, dye on a tissue through through a system because it tells you something about how how thick or thin the channels are and how strong the flow is. And it tells you Something about the values and interests on the tissue. That's one thing and the other thing is of course, as a feminist I'm particularly interested in making my hipster knowledge available on a practical basis I brought along for example, the publication list of the program on limit because I'm interested in getting material that might not get out to the larger audience further up isn't enough for everybody here. I left some on the information counter downstairs either Unknown Speaker 05:31 we could leave it on a place for people interested to go there we could pass it around Now that's enough for Unknown Speaker 05:35 Well no, I did have acidly put some of them downstairs in Brazil. And I even have some of the women in healthcare so what is your name again, Arlene capital que que la and Daniel's da ni ELS and so really what I'm interested in talking about are some of the practical issues involved where are the networks? How are they permeable and impermeable and what makes material flow through them faster so I'm very interested in the problems of simplifying and and presenting data to the media and also very much interested in the problem of getting data to people who need it to work with Unknown Speaker 06:16 students I'm interested in almost anything you have to say but really more in applications like everyday people getting to people really needed spent a couple years and Unknown Speaker 06:41 really loved that Unknown Speaker 06:44 area and are now in the master's program at George Washington University and going from one setting to the other setting because I didn't realize I didn't see your name on the list I'm Carol come with a previous Unknown Speaker 07:14 idea about the study of feminist historical analysis Unknown Speaker 07:38 My name is Celia Wiseman. I'm a senior in college and my background is religion I'm really interested in networks communication as well but I'm particularly fascinated by finding new ways of communicating that are intrinsically more more female and those established by getting back to the body and finding new ways of relating to the college Unknown Speaker 08:22 chambers on developmental psychology one of my my my career intention is to work in the area of psychology and social policy so one of my concerns is how a scholarship is made available or can be made available to policymakers I have enough difficulty making use of scientific information to begin with to make use of some of yours not in mainstream psychology Unknown Speaker 08:59 they're interested in Unknown Speaker 09:00 family capital Unknown Speaker 09:03 obviously Unknown Speaker 09:05 they have particular National Family capital Unknown Speaker 09:15 is you speaking because we've got a very good precedent for that paper nice and steady everybody, this is interaction people tuition Unknown Speaker 09:49 found the institutions the outside world problems So within academia, there's already kind of stratification among scholars is Unknown Speaker 10:13 developing in a major Unknown Speaker 10:19 way. I'm Mike Walker, I am also from Cornell. I have a joint appointment in women's studies ology. And my interests are very similar. The talent has mentioned I sort of see three problem areas for accessibility. One is the problem. Within either academia or even within particular disciplines, the fact that I think there's developing within, among those people working on feminist issues within a sort of stratification is an accessibility problem that has a difference than the old boy network used to. But it's, nonetheless it's a problem, I think it's a dress and make sure, in fact, we aren't setting up new cleats that then see themselves in the band or whatever. I think also, there's the problem of accessibility of process, which I think is extremely important, because I think it's a number of people brought up. We want to develop information and perspectives that people then can use for various purposes. And I think it's particularly detrimental if in fact, as each of us is trying to develop that and get beyond our own disciplines. In fact, we don't develop the sort of sophistication effect you need to work the process. And I'm also interested very much in the accessibility between people within academia and outside. What we do in academia is only valuable insofar as it will be providing people with perspectives and knowledge. Unknown Speaker 12:09 I'm Dee today's I'm in sunny woman. Unknown Speaker 12:17 sense of harmony, I Unknown Speaker 12:18 would add a very interested in Unknown Speaker 12:21 the kind of research jointly cooperative efforts Unknown Speaker 12:28 in scholarship research. Accessibility so that immediately touch, like, Unknown Speaker 12:49 cooperate. There's competition. Or certainly unjoined walstad Unknown Speaker 13:00 and the University of Dover, women's studies in psychology, constraints and say what I'm about to place in this workshop, I think I have some other needs and self interests that are somewhat different from everyone, although I find that extremely interesting. But what I'm interested in, I think sort of it relates to this very much, I think I better get where I can get some survival techniques. Because what I'm interested in that very find to survive within the academy, so to speak, and decided to pay that price and try to do that is channeling, who is constantly pushing you toward the ceiling, pushing you to do this kind of research that will look good on your betta, or dossier or whatever, so that you can get promoted so that you will be able to do your job and make money and survive and so forth. And the pressure is horrendous. And increasingly so as economic future changes for the worse. As there are more and more people clamoring out there for the word feminist scholarship is in many places punished in a sentence in the universities, and all the more so if one tries to make one's work accessible, so that if one really could have the choice between having this piece of work you have done published in this, what's considered the big journal in the field versus output will be accessible for your own survival, the pressure is to do it the other way. And so I'm sort of, I think, got to go where I need a dialogue about that. Yeah, there is and I think I'd better go there although I'm fascinated by this. But since I have so little time, Unknown Speaker 14:47 I will the question you raise is certainly one should do. But I read me why women don't make your popular writing. Unknown Speaker 14:55 Can I just say one thing I think would be created in terms of System System. driven sistership rather than regarding an always within the male terms and seeing it as an individual effort, which becomes part of a zero sum game, I think we can talk about a collaboration and a division of labor. And we certainly tried to do that. And sociologists will rule society. And I don't see why the psychology we couldn't do it either. But caucus by Congress, those of us who are older and have more protection, work to further the interests of those who are younger, those of us who are older, can take risks and write trade books or popular things, if we still have the ability, and can encourage the younger to do the professional publication that will help them and give them that sort of advice, and then divide the task up around so that each individual doesn't take it on her own shoulders to make the revolution and is quite clear that you won't live despite the revolution, if you don't get your tenure. And the older sister should help you do that. Unfortunately, many of the older sisters have been without knowing it co opted by the time they get their 10 year. But anyway, I Unknown Speaker 16:06 think I will change I have the greatest respect for Nancy as she knows, but I don't think nice for you Unknown Speaker 16:16 to take one of my publications. Unknown Speaker 16:27 Below, and I guess I'll say hello. To meet you. I'm from the library staff. And I'm the staff member who is a specialist in women's studies. And my particular interest is the bibliography of women's studies, which serves to list the published research on women, and therefore serves as a primary means of accessibility and I might say have been so recognized by the very early days. Unknown Speaker 16:59 One thing, oddly enough, and no one mentioned, with all the talk about accessibility, it occurred to me that to some extent, you want to open channels to also discover what's relevant to people outside the academy, that it's not only making what's going on inside, accessible, but to find out what the important problems are for people who, whose, whose lives lives and lifestyles are not, you know, familiar to you. Unknown Speaker 17:30 It's good every year, all these things that people have said pretty much outline, to find the problems in this area and a lot of the things that I was going to say, I will make a few remarks about things that I've been thinking of so this is from something I had written a few years ago on research on feminist research, and what what makes feminist research and how it should be dealt with. And I found that it related a lot to the questions I had on my mind about making feminist scholarship accessible. Because I'm very interested in publication outside of academic channels, in other forms of reaching women than publication. I'm very interested in the blue graphic work to libraries and a very important source. So what I took for question for departure and thinking about this problem is, why is it that in fact, we have to talk about making feminist scholarship accessible at all? And why is it to that from the the other side of this coin of we are making, I'm talking about sort of dichotomy and saying there's certain scholars who've got this knowledge, and there's other women who don't, which is obviously not true. feminist scholars, in fact, have to, as people have said, you get that information that already exists in women's lives that many women already know. And in fact, bring it into scholarship. But there is information. There's information that people in feminist Scholarship have unique access to, and we have some training. But particularly access is the most thing that being an academic use you as is privilege. And a lot of this information is relevant to women's lives who don't have access to the information. But there's also a lot of distrust in the feminist movement. And among people in general, who outside of academia, this distrust for scholarship in general. And so I'm wondering what what are the reasons for that? What are the reasons for distrust a feminist scholarship? And obviously, the answers lie in some of the things we heard this morning in the papers that To show the depravity, the dearth of good scholarship in general, you know what has been wrong with scholarship in the past. So that people's distrust of scholarship is correct. And we have to think of what feminist scholarship is doing that makes it not the same as other kinds of scholarship. The problems and the problems that I can identify in traditional kinds of scholarship is, first of all, that it's mystified in a couple of ways. One, it's alienated from general population, people don't know what's going on what scholars do what scholarship means. But it's also mystified to scholars themselves, they think they're doing one thing, and actually, we're doing another and so on. Typically, scholarship has been supported by the power structure, the society makes it possible for certain people to have access to information. The privilege of trend so on, therefore supports typical view of that structure, it supports an elitist view. And as such, researchers typically exploit powerless people who take stories from their lives and takes the experiences of their lives and transforms it in some way. Now, sometimes it may be to get real information from people's lives, other times, it may really distort the information that's there and make false pictures of it and sell it back to us. But when there is true informations gotten from people's lives, typically it still does not get back to the people it was ripped off from. And this is a very typical problem in research on women, which is not the same, obviously, as feminist scholarship. And this kind of research typically takes this information and delivers it as ammunition to the powerful, often to be used against the powerless. So, you know, has followed class lines, it has rationalized ideology, and so on. It's in fact, the pipe polite learning Unknown Speaker 22:22 that we heard about this morning, it's not going to hurt the powerful this is typically what polite means to diffuse power and anger. And of course, it proceeds with bias in this, we all know very well and asking the wrong questions, going about the wrong ways, reaching wrong conclusions, and using people and not involving the right people, and so on and so on. And, in fact, the products of academic research have often been deadly in themselves, as we have seen how the weapons that are produced been produced not only in scientific research, you know, real physical weapons to kill me defoliate and so on, and plans, from political science kind of research, do the same thing. On my own field, as many things destructive kinds of things I can point to in psychology. I jotted some aversive therapy, masculinity, femininity scales, intelligence testing, that is bias to by class, and sex and race and so on. Just the idea of norms and normality and defining lots of behaviors, pathological. And he's having a whole category of what is called pathology, and setting up people as a class of people who are okay to deal with people who aren't okay with the concepts of sex roles and things like Unknown Speaker 23:49 that, sociology takes some credit for sex roles. So, Unknown Speaker 23:58 also, real defining thing of traditional scholarship has been that it this has been, in itself, quite divorced from life here to be really respected, it has to be trivial, or meaningless, or if in fact, its implications have meaning, then they have to be kept out of being put into application. And I say that not facetiously, I really think that it's quite true that if in fact, your scholarship is applied, then it's just stay in and looked down on and this is what make the distinction between pure and applied research and scholarship and all this gives second class to the practitioners to people who are going to put things in application. So, then, you know, the the channels that are your research, the problems we find are narrow, triviality is cultivated to the extent you know in especially the which I mean, all of the fields, you've got these tiny little problems are being pursued and infinitum. So finally, after going through all this horrendous process, there still is some information is valuable to people's lives. And you come down to the limitation, the channels of access, that information is controlled through strict channels, which is, which are meant to keep the information privileged, and to keep it flowing through a sort of meaningless information system. Except insofar as in fact, policymakers have some access to information. And the sense that I mentioned earlier of ripping off information from people's lives using it against them, not lending information back to the soil. And obviously, feminist scholarship, rejects or transforms every one of these problems. And you probably have other problems to add to it, and things that I mentioned. But also, I think, obviously, these aren't reasons enough in themselves to reject scholarship in general. And I presume that's why most of us are here that we see that there's something to be done through scholarship. But and we see there's some value to be gotten out of it. And feminist scholarship is applied without these biases, and kept open. Keeping open access from beginning to end can be valuable. By the way, also, making feminist scholarship accessible, can mean besides our talking about the final part of information in how to people can mean opening up feminist scholarship, so that many more people come into feminist scholarship and are, you have access to being able to pursue that knowledge in the first place, not that others pursue it, and then can make it available to them. And the other side of it, as I said before, is just being able to use other people said, and getting the information of what's important in people's lives and what should be done and learning from people outside of academia, which is really, Denise ProQuest. I think most basically, what feminist scholarship means is to say that scholarship that is for women in women's interests, not necessarily not just that it's by women, because we know that there scholarship by women that has not been for women, and not just that it's about women who there's stuff written about women that does not necessarily help women. So we're talking about scholarships, it's for women, and the basic tenant of that is that theory and practice are not deliberately separated, they're in fact deliberately integrated. Unknown Speaker 28:08 And should be at all stages in the process. I think there's been wider access of feminist scholarship than in other kinds of scholarship. And he's been very clear. And mainly due to the Women's Liberation Movement. We've had women's centers, women's magazines, women's publishing houses, loads of leaflets, and also alternative forms of sharing information such as films and slide and tape shows and radio programs, and women's conferences and women's centers. And so as I think that there's a head start on that, that we have a tradition already of making that scholarship available. And obviously, the more has to be done on that there's a lot of feminists scholarship doesn't reach the people who need to know it. And I think a lot of feminist scholarship that does not take in information from the community. To understand you the critique on the knowledge is going to understand how that knowledge should be pursued. Not just getting down to what I think are the questions, kinds of questions that can be asked to make the results of scholarship accessible means asking questions besides those we've already addressed and defining research questions asking what we mean by knowledge, what the methods are in which people go about it, who is allowed to do the research and so on. But to ask from what women was this information taken and you know, how is the information that you use and will they be given the results and will they be asked to criticize To comment on the results or to know if the the analysis of the information, in fact fits their experience, to whom is the knowledge in fact going to go? Which is your general meta question about channels of access? What are the implications of the knowledge and who has been benefited by the scholarship? How can women benefit? And which women will benefit move taken up? The question? Question has been raised here about crossing class lines and race lines? Which women could most benefit from the information? How can they be reached? How can we get to women who I'd ordinarily reach? And what channels and media can reach them? And also, how can we reach women who are outside this highly verbal culture that we tend to operate in? So we're talking about not just publishing in more open wider areas? And how people are writing, but what about not writing? What other ways of reaching them are there? And what actions does the information read to presume that? If information has a meaning at all, it means that action follows from it. So there should be that automatic integration of what the implications are, what actions follows from it? And then how will they brought be brought about? And feminist scholars should ask the question, do they have an obligation they find information that has implications for action, to in fact, bring about that action? And what things follow from it that feminist scholars not only need to point out, but should they get involved in those things about? How can other women give feedback and criticize? And what opportunities will they have for them? Entering this, this process of theory and practice informing each other and each getting better because of that? So I see some two kinds of sets of questions. There's some kind of basic questions, and there's some very specific questions. basic kinds of questions are, how the information gets passed through the society. The information channels is only God. What kinds of selection? Is there in the channels? Does information come in at the top and filter down? What kinds of transformations does it go through in filtering by top expression? What? What kinds of networks are there in general? How does information pass through feminist network and the other women brought up the question of how other women get into that network? Or how we get the information even out of a feminist network, and we have set up kind of old girl School of passing information around so and analyze analyzing that part to influential people play? And Unknown Speaker 33:07 yeah, what points of access to people have for the information. You know, if you are a woman who has not had an academic training mood to go to find out something, probably go to library, you get it through looking in the newspaper, there might be some directories but it's often very hard to get into the channels that many of us know by word of mouth do exist. So we can ask what parts of that feminist information flow need to be strengthened, needs to be expanded need to be transformed? What parts of it are vulnerable to our parts of the feminist network dependent on certain people who might be lost who might be removed and then that network collapses? A really strong network really needs a lot of people involved. And I guess the practical distribution question says, I was thinking I was on my, my list of questions was different than the prospectus for this conference and ask for the social processes through which knowledge is defined and created and disseminated, which I typically change to dis ovulated wave spreading information. In fact, it implies a seed that we planted is shot out in all directions, secret continue taking the job. And obviously, the answer to that question. Has a lot to do with the accessibility of knowledge. This is the accessibility of the knowledge determines much of what is identified and knowledge and get studied and how and what knowledge gets liberated and for whom, and basically how that affects our lives. And or futures. Now on the specific questions, which I see is largely distribution questions. These I think we can also take up what people want to address, turn and people want to divide things into these these two ways. This thing I mentioned mentioned earlier, too is what are the barriers to non scholarly publication? What are the things that are keeping feminist scholars from publishing outside of scholarly networks. At the same time, people want to know how to get into the scholarly networks. But distribution questions, we've got alternative, you've got scholarly publications, we've got alternative scholarly publication. From those we've got types of media, which may be print, and they can be non print of the print media, you've got other kinds of straight publications that are not necessarily scholarly, we have some sort of semi scholarly intellectual journals, say like, Atlantic Saturday Review or something like that. And then you have other straight publications, which might be women's magazines, such as Women's Day and family circle. You have other kinds of women's magazines that appeal to particular kinds of women like metazoan, Vogue, and so on, you have other general kinds of magazines, you have a lot of specific magazines, also. Magazines is one kind of thing you have, besides straight publication, get alternative ones, got, you know, the whole Feminist Press network possibilities. There's also left press publication. And I say lesbian feminists and I agree with the person who made the point this morning, not differentiating between feminist and lesbian, but I want to make sure that it's clear that includes lesbian feminist publication as alternatives. And there might be other alternative agriculture. Yeah, counter culture in general. Yeah. And then the types of print media can be books in which you have the question then of what categories of things fall into magazines, newspapers, and there you have, not only what types of newspapers, but what sections of newspapers and what type of access, you have leaflets and pamphlets. And of course, women can start their own magazines and they can start their own presses as they have done. Unknown Speaker 37:42 Nancy, don't forget organizational leaflets and letters because those are extraordinarily important way of getting the value added to certain ideas or speakers on topics around the country, something that's passed out as a as a throw away in the League of Women Voters or the association that Giuliana leaves, or the YWCA or someone like that or one of the Christian or other religious fellowship groups is going to reach a very different audience and make an impact on them from what will appear Unknown Speaker 38:15 oh yeah yeah, we I mentioned leaflets but didn't talk about distribution and that can be also personal appearance kinds of things talking to people in terms of Unknown Speaker 38:26 organizations their regular you magazines or Unknown Speaker 38:31 yeah, we can we are okay. Right. The other things besides print media, or non print media course or TV and radio, Unknown Speaker 38:48 there are not only those are talking about as program types of things, but people can also make their own radio programs make their own videotapes make their own films slide and tape shows, information is also spread through talks at conferences and women's centers and schools and so on. Word of mouth is nonprint media. And then there are other print media which are less traditional, like poetry, drama fiction. So there are posters, which have not been used maybe to spread from scholarships so much but this sort of the tool in it and I think that it can be used for late support, or for the ideas of feminist scholarship often is example the something I've been involved in looking at women and language, new words bookstore. Cambridge, has had a couple of posters designed for it, whichever quotations that the need to develop new so that we have the words and these have, I think been interesting in furthering your comments and talk about language, then they're radically different media, if you will, of theater posters is, in fact, one of those puppet shows. Children's Books are another print medium. But you could talk about that as a way of awesome liberating information for your next generation. You can think of ways research centers and calculator which have been started. Women's traveling, boss, information, and so on. Those are just different way of organizing the questions, or the kinds of things that we can look at. I think I'd like to turn it over to other people now, but like to know how much organization you would like to have. Because we've got so many questions, and it's such a broad field from seeing all the things that people raised. We can talk that also might be it's not that distinguishable, separates and COVID this kind of question with that kind of question. As I say, we can talk about some more basic questions we just simply whose application we're distribution has questions or we can talk more specifically about distribution problems or anybody want to make suggestions Unknown Speaker 41:39 because when you study distribution, you also study the way a network is growing strength, strengths and weaknesses are, there are some ways in which the feminist movement has parallels to other open the feminist movement in the earlier students in civil protests, a lot of research was done by people outside the academy USBasp. And that research, whether it was done sloppily or not, was so more and so deadly. In his in his findings that was picked up in lots of ways by much more respectable researchers. So was a legitimate entry into the field of discourse so that you could no longer as a scholar, who Bucha political science or sociology or government, the work of people like Ridgeway, I can't really name a lot because their work has been picked up and validated by others. I think the best example of how the feminist nice to take certain works and see what happened to them is our bodies ourselves. And the best place to study the cross fertilization across popular in the government in the women's world is willing to help. Because you see that the popularizers more than non scientific researchers have raised questions or have pointed toward neglected in the scientific field up to that point, but done by respected researchers. And then they have in terms stimulated new kinds of research and made it seem more reasonable to push on NIH, or NSF, or money to study issues which have been relatively low priority or non existent before. Now, without dwelling on past successes. In some ways. I can't think of another winner, another Gone With the Wind, like our bodies ourselves. But there have been surprising sleepers. I mean, the big thing really, survival do women survive? Yeah, right. The Source Book and other other heavier burdens. Unknown Speaker 43:56 That was published by Kendra W. I'm running away from home. Unknown Speaker 44:01 Yes, that was a great win, which sold a Unknown Speaker 44:03 lot of them was picked up Unknown Speaker 44:04 by a commercial publisher. And I'm sure that there have have been others. I wanted Unknown Speaker 44:09 to make sure that people know what we're talking about that our bodies or cells with the background Unknown Speaker 44:15 was produced by collected some academic connections but tenuous and by no means organized. Unknown Speaker 44:23 What's interesting about its history is that also, there have been debates around the advisability of the women's movement to commercial publications first circulated by press, so many copies 1000s of copies, one by newly free press, newly New England, New England and was the biggest seller and so there was some controversy when the women decided to accept the offer from the house. New England Free Press was not happy with it just recently in women's press in Now, SR courage which is published in the Boston area, there's been a debate on feminist publishing, you know where the the access should be. The women of our bodies ourselves explain why they went to commercial publisher. Other women put Unknown Speaker 45:18 forward those strong arguments that Unknown Speaker 45:20 women should stay with feminists presses and tried to few felt they refuted all the arguments that women are going inside of the Feminist Press Unknown Speaker 45:31 or a little pile of crap. Because first of all, it's extremely insular in the second place is kind of dog in the manger My God, they made a big pile off that already. They are they're quickly going to run to the, to the limits of their own dissemination or whatever and production resources. And I think in a sense that you know, they've creamed it off and now let it go on and serve many more the fact that the rule also made more money. It should not denigrate the project that will make it available to a much wider audience. Unknown Speaker 46:03 There's an issue that might be a rumor but our daughters had originally decided not to sell Ruby fruit jungle which is reading a book